"Kindness" plugin

[Jordan Miller]

Hey Invision, hope you're having a great December.

So, I had an idea.

One of my main missions this year was to elevate the culture in my forum and make it a kinder place. I feel like I have achieved success in that regard, however I still see comments that I find pretty questionable despite the warning points system, moderators, rules etc that are in place.

My idea is to develop a Kindness plugin.

There's a lot that can be done, and I'd love to hear your guys' feedback, but the first thing I'd like to have this plugin do is create essentially a little check box that the member must select that essentially says "This comment is kind" before they can successfully hit the reply button.

Yes, they could still write something negative or rude and check the box and post it, but I would like to see how that plays out. I do think psychologically it would be more difficult for people in general to say, "yes this is kind" when they know it isn't. 

I thought of starting with simply changing the language of "Submit Reply" to something else, but think that might be a little clunky. 

What do you guys think? I'm open to suggestions of course! Thanks =]

[Guest]

KINDNESS 

[Morrigan]

I think the concept is moderately interesting but I certainly wouldn't want to "accept a terms of service" every time I submit something, at least not personally.

[SC36DC]

I do like the idea. As long as the checkbox is right next to the 'Submit Reply' button, I don't see it being a problem. Also, if they click 'Submit Reply' but have not checked the 'Kindness' box, then they will see a message letting them know that they first need to make sure their comment is kind, and they need to check the box confirming so.

 

[Guest]

59 minutes ago, SC36DC said:

I do like the idea. As long as the checkbox is right next to the 'Submit Reply' button, I don't see it being a problem. Also, if they click 'Submit Reply' but have not checked the 'Kindness' box, then they will see a message letting them know that they first need to make sure their comment is kind, and they need to check the box confirming so.

 

Yea!!! I love this idea. It’s one extra step but takes a fraction of a second. 🙏

Edited December 23, 2020 by breatheheavy

[Noble~]

I like this as well.

[Guest]

18 hours ago, Morrigan said:

I think the concept is moderately interesting

[Everade]

Sounds like you're just trying to annoy a handful of people who're not kind by nature, and end up sacrificing the patience of the kind majority.

Edited December 23, 2020 by Everade

[PoC2]

People read the room.

The tone of the room is set by the moderators, not a checkbox or plugin.

[Davyc]

Why not add a reaction to symbolise the 'kindness' of people - that's what the reactions are for, basically to gauge someone's reaction 🙂

 

[Guest]

On 12/24/2020 at 3:36 AM, Davyc said:

Why not add a reaction to symbolise the 'kindness' of people - that's what the reactions are for, basically to gauge someone's reaction 🙂

 

We have that currently 🙂  But I do think it'd be interesting to have a feature where members have to agree that their comment is kind before it gets posted. If we have a "kindness" reaction, the comment has already been posted. I'd like to be one step ahead with this =]

On 12/24/2020 at 3:16 AM, PoC2 said:

People read the room.

The tone of the room is set by the moderators, not a checkbox or plugin.

I don't actually agree with this. 🙏 Some times conversations get out of hand, especially dealing with fanbases stanning pop stars. 

On 12/23/2020 at 9:35 AM, Everade said:

Sounds like you're just trying to annoy a handful of people who're not kind by nature, and end up sacrificing the patience of the kind majority.

Patience is a virtue. =] But honestly I don't see it taking much patience to use this feature. It takes a fraction of a second to tap a "heart" or something to remind the user that comment is kind before it gets posted. 

[PoC2]

Disagree as you wish of course. My experience is from running online forums since the 1990s.

I don’t have to argue the point. Experience will out in the end.

[Davyc]

1 hour ago, breatheheavy said:

where members have to agree that their comment is kind before it gets posted

 

You've kind of lost me here - if members have to agree that a comment is kind before it's posted, how can they do that if the comment hasn't been posted for them to see whether it's kind or not - fuzzy? Unless you mean that the member posting the comment has to agree that what they are posting is kind before they can post it; if so, then they could do that whether they believe it to be kind or not just to get it posted.  Different people can have dissimilar views as to what they believe to be kind.  I would say let them post what they want and let the members decide by their reactions or comments whether they believe a post is kind or not.

Seems like you're aiming to make a lot of work for your community and yourself.  However, it's your site, your forum you do as you think best, but I doubt if anyone will make a plugin for this, unless they do so for the hell of it and make it free 🙂

 

[Noble~]

@breatheheavy this one may be what your looking for?

 

[SC36DC]

The 'Kindness' plugin is basically a captcha step that someone would take, BEFORE posting a reply or comment. Since it would simply be a checkbox placed right next to the 'Submit Reply' button, it really isn't any extra work for the user to do. It would only take a fraction of a second to do.

The idea behind this simple checkbox is this, "Before posting this comment, are you ensuring that when read by any other member of the forum, it will not be taken as being offensive or  aggressive? If not, then please proceed with the post". Something like that, from my understanding. It's pretty much just a reminder for people to think before they post.

 

[Morrigan]

4 hours ago, SC36DC said:

It's pretty much just a reminder for people to think before they post.

Read nuisance and people will check it and STILL not give two damns about it. Its a barrier for posting and NOTHING more.

[Guest]

19 hours ago, SC36DC said:

The 'Kindness' plugin is basically a captcha step that someone would take, BEFORE posting a reply or comment. Since it would simply be a checkbox placed right next to the 'Submit Reply' button, it really isn't any extra work for the user to do. It would only take a fraction of a second to do.

The idea behind this simple checkbox is this, "Before posting this comment, are you ensuring that when read by any other member of the forum, it will not be taken as being offensive or  aggressive? If not, then please proceed with the post". Something like that, from my understanding. It's pretty much just a reminder for people to think before they post.

Nailed it!!!

14 hours ago, Morrigan said:

Read nuisance and people will check it and STILL not give two damns about it. Its a barrier for posting and NOTHING more.

I disagree. It may be a nuisance to some, but to those that want the community to be a positive place, I imagine they'll welcome this with open arms. Also keep in mind this isn't a required plugin lol so any community owner who doesn't want to use this can feel free to pass. 🙏 

If people check the box and continue to be icky members, it'll be a lot easier to suspend or ban them because they displayed a blatant disregard for the rules. 

[Morrigan]

54 minutes ago, breatheheavy said:

I disagree. It may be a nuisance to some, but to those that want the community to be a positive place, I imagine they'll welcome this with open arms.

If you want a positive place you make it with how you handle things and people.

Adding a barrier to posting IS a nuisance for all. People get annoyed having to accept a Terms of Service in the first place and now you want to make them accept it EVERY TIME THEY POST!? That's ludicrous and will only earn ire of "Why do I have to do this every time?" and "Is there a way to auto check this so I don't have to do it every time I post? Everything I say is kind," sort of complaints and asks from your members. You will also get people asking "Why do you need this?" and "Where did my post go?" because they posted and clicked away to go do something else and forgot the check box.

If you want it, get it commissioned. There is no reason for this to be in core now or in the future.

[Davyc]

I reckon you are looking to create a Utopian type site where all negativity is banned regardless of whether it's warranted or not.  It akin to "I like your point of view, as long as it's my view too".  Good debate is rarely polite or kind, the essence of rationalised negativity promotes thought and often refers people to re-evaluate their stance in whatever the debate is about.  If you remove that element, then you will just have a site full of sheep with no room for the occasional bad egg and everyone who has a different point of view will be barred from asserting their views. I doubt that I would appreciate being a member of such as site and this opinion would most likely see me being penalised as it could be viewed as being unkind 😉

On the process of asking for such a plugin, this topic would be better placed in the Marketplace Customisation Requests forum.  This not something I believe would sit well in the core whether it was optional or not; there are more imaginative ideas for core features.

[Morrigan]

11 minutes ago, Davyc said:

I reckon you are looking to create a Utopian type site where all negativity is banned regardless of whether it's warranted or not.  It akin to "I like your point of view, as long as it's my view too".  Good debate is rarely polite or kind, the essence of rationalised negativity promotes thought and often refers people to re-evaluate their stance in whatever the debate is about.  If you remove that element, then you will just have a site full of sheep with no room for the occasional bad egg and everyone who has a different point of view will be barred from asserting their views. I doubt that I would appreciate being a member of such as site and this opinion would most likely see me being penalised as it could be viewed as being unkind 😉

On the process of asking for such a plugin, this topic would be better placed in the Marketplace Customisation Requests forum.  This not something I believe would sit well in the core whether it was optional or not; there are more imaginative ideas for core features.

You make me wish my "F Yeah" reaction was here. Or "Agree" or any of my fun ones were here.

[bosss]

Utopia

We are not the same and that is ok - what is positive for me - that not mean that should be positive to some another or opposite!

Better to have some functionality plugins!

[Guest]

4 hours ago, Morrigan said:

If you want a positive place you make it with how you handle things and people.

Adding a barrier to posting IS a nuisance for all. People get annoyed having to accept a Terms of Service in the first place and now you want to make them accept it EVERY TIME THEY POST!? That's ludicrous and will only earn ire of "Why do I have to do this every time?" and "Is there a way to auto check this so I don't have to do it every time I post? Everything I say is kind," sort of complaints and asks from your members. You will also get people asking "Why do you need this?" and "Where did my post go?" because they posted and clicked away to go do something else and forgot the check box.

If you want it, get it commissioned. There is no reason for this to be in core now or in the future.

I appreciate the heated passion behind your responses. 

It's worth mentioning that it doesn't *have* to be a core feature of the platform (though I think it would be beneficial if it was available to turn on or off). I am merely asking for feedback regarding a plugin/app that's designed to keep things positive as much as possible. If someone had to tap a heart for instance before tapping the Submit Reply button, I personally don't feel that that's such a hassle. It sounds like that is something you wouldn't like and I hear you. =] 

Edited December 26, 2020 by breatheheavy

[Morrigan]

1 minute ago, breatheheavy said:

I appreciate the heated passion behind your responses. 

It's worth mentioning that I was not asking this to be considered a core feature of the platform. I am merely asking for feedback regarding a plugin/app that's designed to keep things positive as much as possible. If someone had to tap a heart for instance before tapping the Submit Reply button, I personally don't feel that that's such a hassle. It sounds like that is something you wouldn't like and I hear you. =] 

This isn't the right forum for that. This is for suggestions and feedback for the core platform.

You may think "clicking a heart" before posting will not be a hassle but in UX design you want to make everything the FEWEST clicks possible. Adding clicks is a hassle and is difficult and is not good UI.

Client lounge or General Chit Chat is better for something like this.

[Guest]

3 hours ago, Davyc said:

I reckon you are looking to create a Utopian type site where all negativity is banned regardless of whether it's warranted or not.  It akin to "I like your point of view, as long as it's my view too".  Good debate is rarely polite or kind, the essence of rationalised negativity promotes thought and often refers people to re-evaluate their stance in whatever the debate is about.  If you remove that element, then you will just have a site full of sheep with no room for the occasional bad egg and everyone who has a different point of view will be barred from asserting their views. I doubt that I would appreciate being a member of such as site and this opinion would most likely see me being penalised as it could be viewed as being unkind 😉

On the process of asking for such a plugin, this topic would be better placed in the Marketplace Customisation Requests forum.  This not something I believe would sit well in the core whether it was optional or not; there are more imaginative ideas for core features.

Going to have to agree to disagree. I am personally not inquiring about this because I want a Utopian type site. I know different point of views are essential to keeping conversations ongoing and engaging. This idea doesn't encourage people to have similar views or outlooks, rather it's a reminder that before they post their point of view, it doesn't tear someone down. 

Fanbases of pop stars tend to be emotionally charged, and things can get out of hand a lot faster (imo) than other niche communities. Hence what inspired this. 

I think your comment is a great example of it disagreeing with mine, but doing so in a respectful way. However, I am not convinced that "good debate is rarely polite." I believe that an ingredient for good debate is that the debater shows restraint and thought in a way that is polite. It's easy to fly off the handles or respond on a whim with harsh sentiment.  If someone can comment get their point across, even if it's completely contrasting from the person they're responding to, and do it in a way that's kind and polite (I'm not looking for rainbows and sprinkles, just respect), then that's a quality comment 🙂

1 minute ago, Morrigan said:

This isn't the right forum for that.

You're quick! I edited my response previously but either way I hear you. Thank you. 

[Guest]

3 minutes ago, Morrigan said:

You may think "clicking a heart" before posting will not be a hassle but in UX design you want to make everything the FEWEST clicks possible. Adding clicks is a hassle and is difficult and is not good UI.

I suppose I should dive a little deeper into my desire behind this idea.

Yes, it's one more step and doesn't head in the direction of good UI/UX, but it does head in the direction of quality commenting which is overall the ultimate goal (for me). 

Social media giants like Instagram and TikTok as we speak are rolling out new terms and conditions that crack down on the kinds of comments people can leave. People are being banned left and right from the platforms for calling someone "dumb" for instance.

It is a form of censorship, however it's because of the mighty dollar. Advertisers don't want their ads appearing on content that isn't family friendly. 

I feel like it's only a matter of time until Google follows suit and lays down the hammer more than they do. I think it's important that forum communities begin implementing things to stay ahead of the curve. I'm a Google Certified Publisher, so the last thing I want is to get de-monetized because my forum isn't considered valuable to advertisers. 

Hope that makes sense.