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usmf Rising Star

usmf

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We've got some weird stuff going on with notifications -- noticeably on a particular thread:

https://www.usmilitariaforum.com/forums/index.php?/topic/1900-military-lighters-all-eras-all-brands/page/38/

Member has been following the above thread and always received email notifications for new replies within the thread.  It changed over the past month or so. Been getting emails that give indication that someone has liked or responded to their post, but if somebody posts something new he doesn't get anything. We tried setting it up for push and notifications this weekend, but that didn't change it. He is getting the bell bubble notification on the forum itself, but no emails. 

 I also experimented and started following the thread myself (Admin account), and I'm not getting email notifications for new replies in the thread, either. I get the red bubble notification, but no email notification.
 
The notification emails are not in the email SPAM folders. Both accounts receive email notifications for PMs, PM replies, Quoted content replies, and other threads/boards that are followed. 
 
I can supply links to the two accounts mentioned above that have tested and experienced this issue, but I hate to post that in a public thread here. Let me know if you need them.
Another member has been experiencing the same no-email-notifications issue since late last year, too - in the same Sale section listed above, not just one thread. Let me know if you'd like that username.

At this point, we need to figure out where the notifications are failing. Is the thread triggering the emails? Is the forum sending them? Where does the path fail? 

 

Another part of this issue has been going on since late last year (2022) is the same issue . . . this time it is following actual boards, not threads. 
 
We have a section of boards here:
 
A member has been following each board in this section for a long time, and starting late last year, is no longer getting notification emails. Only the notification bell bubble on the forum. We have tried swapping email addresses for the account, even creating another account and following his content and then merging the two accounts. No emails of notifications for new content. 
 
Yesterday (21 June 2023), another member (normal "Member" user group) and I (Admin user group) tested this. We followed three boards in this section:
 
 
I created a new thread in each and the other member received a bubble notification but no email notifications for any of the three threads. Then the other member created threads and I received the red bubble, but no emails. 
Again, I can send those usernames if you need them.
 
Appreciate the help.
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  • 4 weeks later...
usmf Rising Star

usmf

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Hi, again! 

It's been a bit, but we have had the server tech and some others working on this from our end. Every test has been run, everything is checked, updated, etc. No changes. Had a meeting with the server guy, and he says there is nothing more he can do, it's the software. So, being a tech member only, I enlisted one of the active Admins to help me with this. They're the one fielding all the questions/problem reports/complaints over this, so they sent the following info which should give you everything you need.

Let me know if you need more info than the original post and this below. Thanks.

-----------------------------------------------------

OK . . . I went back and found the original Help thread and it was actually July 18th. Three members had noticed "several weeks" when they realised it. These members:
 
 
 
 
 
First was alerted to this on July 18th. Several members realised that they had not received notifications for new threads/topics posted in boards that they were following. PArticularly these boards:
 

FS Field & Personal Gear

FS Books, Photos, Ephemera, & Research Material

FS Medals, Decorations, Ribbons, & Accessories

FS Cloth & Metal Insignia

 FS Knives and Other Weapons & Accessories

 FS Miscellaneous

Discussion forum on Medals & Decorations

For Sale Uniforms, Helmets and Medals & Decorations.

 
 

https://www.usmilitariaforum.com/forums/index.php?/topic/1900-military-lighters-all-eras-all-brands/page/38/

 
Member has been following the above thread and always received email notifications for new replies within the thread.  It changed over the past month or so. Been getting emails that give indication that someone has liked or responded to their post, but if somebody posts something new he doesn't get anything. I tried setting it up for push and notifications this weekend, but that didn't change it. He is getting the red bubble notification on the forum itself, but no emails. 
 
 I also experimented and started following the thread myself (Admin account), and I'm not getting email notifications for new replies in the thread, either. I get the red bubble notification, but no email notification.
 
The notification emails are not in the email SPAM folders. Both accounts receive email notifications for PMs, PM replies, Quoted content replies, and other threads/boards that are followed. 
 
This is the link to the member's account:
 
This is the link to my Admin account:
 
 
Another member has been experiencing the same no-email-notifications issue since late last year, too - in the same Sale section listed above:
https://www.usmilitariaforum.com/forums/index.php?/profile/143523-schk/


At this point, we need to figure out where the notifications are failing. Is the thread triggering the emails? Is the forum sending them? Where does the path fail? 
 
 
Something that has been going on since late last year (2022) is the same issue . . . this time it is following actual boards, not threads. 
 
We have a section of boards here:
 
A member has been following each board in this section for a long time, and starting late last year, is no longer getting notification emails. Only the red bubble on the forum. We have tried swapping email addresses for the account, even creating another account and following his content and then merging the two accounts. No emails of notifications for new content. 
 
Today (21 June 2023), another member (normal "Member" user group) and myself (Admin group) tested this. We both followed three boards in this section:
 
 
I created a new thread in each and the other member received a bubble notification but no email notifications for any of the three threads. Then the other member created threads and I received the red bubble, but no emails. 
 
This is my account:
 
This is the other member's account:

 

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Marc Stridgen Grand Master

Marc Stridgen

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1 hour ago, usmf said:

Member has been following the above thread and always received email notifications for new replies within the thread.  It changed over the past month or so

I notice here the member actually refollowed that item a month ago, so was not following at that time. This may have something to do with it here.

Question for you. Are these people who have been following an item for over a year possibly?

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usmf Rising Star

usmf

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The reason that they had to refollow was that we had people stop following for a time to find out if the notifications would kick back in. 

Some of the people affected have followed for more than a year, some only months. And some accounts unfollowed for awhile and have just started again in the last three weeks. All are still experiencing the same issues.

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Marc Stridgen Grand Master

Marc Stridgen

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the ones who have been following for more than a year, please bear in mind your settings will remove followers after 12 months. I see you have now amended that on your system.

With the others, I will need an example member and content item you know them to be following, that you are happy for me to change the email address on. We can then take a look at that.

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usmf Rising Star

usmf

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Absolutely. Use this account:

https://www.usmilitariaforum.com/forums/index.php?/profile/299859-gcce1854/

It is following these three boards:

 
Back in June, I created a new thread in each and the other member received a bubble notification but no email notifications for any of the three threads. Then the above account created threads and I received the red bubble, but no emails. We tested this again a few days ago, and it is still the same.
 
Oh, and yes -- we should have the system amended to not remove followers after a year. If you see that still active there, please feel free to remove that. We want them to be able to follow for as long as they want. Thanks. 
Edited by usmf
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Jim M Grand Master

Jim M

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Appreciate you answering all the questions and working with us on this. I do have one last question then will dive into the information provided. You mentioned that they did receive the bubble (inline) notification but no email. Was the user online (within 15 min) of the topic being created? If so, no email would be generated in that scenario.

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usmf Rising Star

usmf

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Thanks so much for working on this. 

Good question, but we did test that. E-mails are not generated, even when the account does not check in for days. In fact, the account that I gave you above to try was set to follow multiple things experiencing this issue. Then, the account was not checked for five or six days. There were a LOT of red notification bubble counts, but not one e-mail had arrived.

Feel free to ask any other questions. I'm just happy to be working on this.

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Jim M Grand Master

Jim M

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Thank you for answering that. Unfortunately, when sending a test email via your community, it says that it is successfully sent but I do not receive it when sending to Gmail addresses. I received it fine sending to my own personal email that is not as strict as Gmail but Gmail, it was never received, not even in spam.

The user you provided there is using Gmail as their email address. You can test this by going to ACP -> System -> Email Settings -> Test Settings (top right). 

It could be that Gmail has blocked your server for emails, you're not passing required items in your DNS for "allowing" your domain to send from your server, etc... 

If you have a non-Gmail email address, they receive topic notifications, as seen here:

Could contain: File, Page, Text, Webpage, Computer Hardware, Electronics, Hardware

 

I'm afraid, at the end of the day, this is not a software problem but a server problem with mail getting blocked or incorrectly configured. Sorry we don't have better news for you.

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usmf Rising Star

usmf

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I am not happy with that. Unacceptable reply. While GMail addresses are affected, not all GMail addresses are affected. Some are receiving notifications, so it's not ALL GMail. Also, the affected Gmail accounts are receiving notifications for the majority of followed things. This is not something that is affecting 100% of Gmail. The DNS was already checked, reset, etc. This forum is on a dedicated server. 

There has got to be something more to look at here. Notifications are a vital part of any forum. We need this fixed. Please transfer this help issue/ticket to someone who is willing to provide us with the tech support we pay for.

Edited by usmf
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Jim M Grand Master

Jim M

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50 minutes ago, usmf said:

I am not happy with that. Unacceptable reply. While GMail addresses are affected, not all GMail addresses are affected. Some are receiving notifications, so it's not ALL GMail. Also, the affected Gmail accounts are receiving notifications for the majority of followed things. This is not something that is affecting 100% of Gmail. The DNS was already checked, reset, etc. This forum is on a dedicated server. 

There has got to be something more to look at here. Notifications are a vital part of any forum. We need this fixed. Please transfer this help issue/ticket to someone who is willing to provide us with the tech support we pay for.

I am sorry that you do not like the answer but I have shown, I just received email notifications and then did not due to issues beyond the software’s control on the same forum and same user.

Please keep in mind that email sending and deliverability are server issues. Our software only passes the email off to your server (think like you handing a letter off to a postal worker). 

Gmail is just an example, it could be these other email providers are also blocking you due to the things mentioned. You should check your mail sever IP address to see if it is blacklisted and check to ensure that you have authorized your domain correctly to send mail. Email is a very hard thing to keep secure and running properly, why SMTP and mail sending services are very popular.

However, as mentioned, a good starting off point is to verify if your email address is indeed receiving the Test Email I mentioned in my previous reply. If it isn’t, again, this is an issue with your email deliverability from your server, not a software issue. If you do receive it and have a forum you do not receive email notifications, we can investigate and see that user and forum. 

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usmf Rising Star

usmf

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Got in touch with the server guy -- here's the answer.

 

The main issue here is not that no email is being received to gmail, the main issue is that SOME email for specific functions are not being received at gmail but MOST functions are being received at gmail. This immediately points to a configuration issue with the forum software and not the server.  If it was happening to ALL email going to Gmail then I agree it is a server issue as all email is coming from the same server/ipaddress. But that is not the case here.
 
Here is the blacklist report from MXToolbox - everything is clear:

Network Tools DNS,IP,Email.pdf

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Jim M Grand Master

Jim M

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6 minutes ago, usmf said:

The main issue here is not that no email is being received to gmail, the main issue is that SOME email for specific functions are not being received at gmail but MOST functions are being received at gmail

I'm afraid, any deliverability issues what-so-ever fall on the server provider, not the software. The software has 0 control over what gets delivered. We just hand it off to server. If this was a software issue, we would not be getting any emails sent because the software does not care about the email address, it produces the same email and hands it off to the server.

The suggestions provided are merely suggestions. We don't know what is causing your deliverability issue. That is the responsibility of your email provider, in this case your server, to find out.

I would suggest switching to another email provider to simply test but ensure you configure it fully.

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usmf Rising Star

usmf

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2 hours ago, Jim M said:

I'm afraid, any deliverability issues what-so-ever fall on the server provider, not the software. The software has 0 control over what gets delivered. We just hand it off to server. If this was a software issue, we would not be getting any emails sent because the software does not care about the email address, it produces the same email and hands it off to the server.

The suggestions provided are merely suggestions. We don't know what is causing your deliverability issue. That is the responsibility of your email provider, in this case your server, to find out.

I would suggest switching to another email provider to simply test but ensure you configure it fully.

The server will simply relay the information that the software is using. 

The problem in debugging this is emails are being delivered to email accounts on gmail for most functions, however, for specific functions with specific users email is not being delivered to a gmail account - this has been outlined to you in previous posts. 

If this was a server issue then all email being sent to gmail email accounts would not be delivered showing that a server configuration error is interfering with the deliver-ability of all email being sent to gmail.  This is not the case and for you to say that "any deliverability issues what-so-ever fall on the server provider, not the software." is blanket statement not directed at a specific issue.  

I am requesting a phone conference with a upper level engineer to help debug this problem with our webmaster (Scott Dafferner  714-842-7485 notify him with a time and date).  We have traced when the issue started and it corresponds with the software update installed October of 2022. 

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Jim M Grand Master

Jim M

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13 minutes ago, usmf said:

The server will simply relay the information that the software is using. 

The problem in debugging this is emails are being delivered to email accounts on gmail for most functions, however, for specific functions with specific users email is not being delivered to a gmail account - this has been outlined to you in previous posts. 

If this was a server issue then all email being sent to gmail email accounts would not be delivered showing that a server configuration error is interfering with the deliver-ability of all email being sent to gmail.  This is not the case and for you to say that "any deliverability issues what-so-ever fall on the server provider, not the software." is blanket statement not directed at a specific issue.  

I need to stress here that once the email has been passed to your server to handle email send, we have no impact on it what-so-ever. We have proved that your community is sending email notifications and successfully passing off emails to your email server. We are unable to inspect and debug server email sending, however, I would suggest switching to an email provider, like SendGrid, to take your server completely out of the equation.

If you are seeing server errors in your server error log when these emails are being handed off, we would need those logs. Otherwise, there are no interruptions and email hand-off is working from the logs and testing we performed.

13 minutes ago, usmf said:

I am requesting a phone conference with a upper level engineer to help debug this problem with our webmaster (Scott Dafferner  714-842-7485 notify him with a time and date).  We have traced when the issue started and it corresponds with the software update installed October of 2022. 

Sorry, we do not offer phone support. I have asked a developer to take a second look at this. Someone will be with you as soon as they can.

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nodle Rising Star

nodle

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I am going to throw this out there, after reading this post I noticed that I was no longer receiving email anymore for someone replying to a post etc. When sending a test email from the ACP I still was not able to receive it. I went to my server and looked at my logs and it had something to do with DMARC. Since I use Cloudflare I had to go in there and configure a few things, but now everything is working fine again. So, I don't know if you use Cloudflare but if you do check your settings, they must have made changes here a few weeks ago, because it always worked before then. I don't know if it's related to your scenario or not.

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usmf Rising Star

usmf

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20 hours ago, nodle said:

I am going to throw this out there, after reading this post I noticed that I was no longer receiving email anymore for someone replying to a post etc. When sending a test email from the ACP I still was not able to receive it. I went to my server and looked at my logs and it had something to do with DMARC. Since I use Cloudflare I had to go in there and configure a few things, but now everything is working fine again. So, I don't know if you use Cloudflare but if you do check your settings, they must have made changes here a few weeks ago, because it always worked before then. I don't know if it's related to your scenario or not.

Hi Nodle,

Thank you for your input.  The problem has been present since October of Last year. We have been testing to make it easy for Invision to replicate the issue within specific forums and threads to show that email is being received at a gmail account for some functions but other specific function notifications are not being received at a gmail account. We really believe that there was an issue with the software update installed in october.

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Jim M Grand Master

Jim M

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6 minutes ago, usmf said:

I have heard nothing regarding this issue.  I am the server manager and need to be included in the correspondence aws Bob is out of the country.

The conversation will happen here in this topic. Please note I have removed your email as this is a public forum. I'm afraid, it can take some time to get a second review but as mentioned above, nothing is out of line with the software that we can see at this time.

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usmf Rising Star

usmf

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Okay. Looking forward to hearing something. This is a definitely problem, and it has been two weeks since you asked a developer to look at this. It is not unreasonable for us to be wondering when some kind of help will be posted.

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Lindy Grand Master

Lindy

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@usmf I'm sorry you're experiencing issues with email delivery. As has been mentioned, our team has confirmed email notifications are being sent. We understand you are having isolated issues with specific members. I've personally looked and it doesn't appear you have a DMARC record for your domain. This was mentioned elsewhere in this topic -- not having a DMARC record will most certainly lead to deliverability issues. 

I know you believe this is software related traced back to an update applied from October 22, but a quick cursory glance at your domain record indicates you updated DNS in October as well.

Domain Name: USMILITARIAFORUM.COMRegistry Domain ID: 645381455_DOMAIN_COM-VRSN
Registrar WHOIS Server: whois.wildwestdomains.com
Registrar URL: http://www.wildwestdomains.com
Updated Date: 2022-10-26T23:33:02Z
Creation Date: 2006-10-25T05:13:23Z
Registry Expiry Date: 2023-10-25T05:13:23Z

I would guess you made changes and a DMARC was not configured at that time. 

This kind of thing often happens in the self-hosted environment as not everyone has experience to manage servers, DNS, etc.... that is precisely why we offer Invision Community Cloud 🙂 

I think getting someone with some experience to help you resolve these technical issues will resolve your concern. If you still feel there is a software issue, we do offer advanced diagnostics and debugging services. This is $200 per hour with a one hour minimum. If the issue does in fact end up being directly software related, that fee is of course refunded in full. 

Good luck - I hope you're able to resolve this issue. 

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