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ellawella Explorer

ellawella

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Yet you fail to explain why? :whistle: ...maybe save the unnecessary statements to a time that is appropriate or maybe, just maybe when you've learnt a bit into the definition of Dopey and my personal background?


OK, in future I'll be sure to state the obvious, look up words I know the definition to and always ask people for their biography before I address them.
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tomek__w Newbie

tomek__w

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Then we get grief for having private testers. No, really. There is a topic here on this forum where people are all upset that we have private testers who get releases before general users.



Just can't win. I shall cry now: :'(


Ah, but "What the eye don't see the heart don't grieve over" and yes, I know that you can't win, no matter what you do!

I certainly don't see why private testers or, if you prefer, beta testers are unfair as they ensure that when a piece of software is released it is that much closer to being 'perfect' and thus fewer people have problems and fewer people are likely to complain - especially the complaints about having problems on live systems even though they have been warned clearly not to apply the version on a live system..........

I guess that the problem, over the years, has been of your own making by 'pampering' your users/customers. OK, I know that this has contributed to the success and popularity of the software but it also has to be said that people notice complaints more (and moan even more) than they see the positive aspects.

I wonder what percentage of customers actually wait until after the 'final' has been released before using it compared to the people who apply change after change after change (RC1, RC2, RC3 etc - and still complain) and then finally apply the final version......... plus of course having to contend with mods etc.

I for one would much rather see a new version be 'final' on release and be even more excited about it and I certainly would not even dream of using a new version until final.

I would also hope that the customer base would actually appreciate the fact that a select group of very experienced/knowledgable beta testers had worked hard to ensure that the rest of us get a 'final' that is close to perfect without having to go through any 'pain' themselves.

Just my 2 pence worth.
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Charles Grand Master

Charles

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Ah, but "What the eye don't see the heart don't grieve over" and yes, I know that you can't win, no matter what you do!



I certainly don't see why private testers or, if you prefer, beta testers are unfair as they ensure that when a piece of software is released it is that much closer to being 'perfect' and thus fewer people have problems and fewer people are likely to complain - especially the complaints about having problems on live systems even though they have been warned clearly not to apply the version on a live system..........



I guess that the problem, over the years, has been of your own making by 'pampering' your users/customers. OK, I know that this has contributed to the success and popularity of the software but it also has to be said that people notice complaints more (and moan even more) than they see the positive aspects.



I wonder what percentage of customers actually wait until

after

the 'final' has been released before using it compared to the people who apply change after change after change (RC1, RC2, RC3 etc - and still complain) and then finally apply the final version......... plus of course having to contend with mods etc.



I for one would much rather see a new version be 'final' on release and be even more excited about it and I certainly would not even dream of using a new version until final.



I would also hope that the customer base would actually appreciate the fact that a select group of very experienced/knowledgable beta testers had worked hard to ensure that the rest of us get a 'final' that is close to perfect without having to go through any 'pain' themselves.



Just my 2 pence worth.




The 2.2 series was the first release that used private testers throughout. They all have to sign non-disclosure agreements and, by keeping the group small, we can get a bit more detailed with the problems they have or issues they notice.

One problem we have is that in reality no one really tests the product during a beta. Sure people click around and report bugs but it is not until the final is release and people truly start using things that you get a real feel for how stable the release is. As I mentioned on our company blog, we knew we would have to do a 2.2.1 soon after 2.2.0 because no matter what you do something always comes up once the masses start using a release.

In the end the private beta test group has been a great asset this time around and we are going to keep them around for the next series of IP.Board. They are already testing the latest builds of some of our yet to be released products.
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Rikki Grand Master

Rikki

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Also, early on in the development, the bugs tend to be a lot more obvious. If we released early betas to thousands of people, it'd be a nightmare having to deal with all the reports of the same bug (that's what used to happen). In a small group, it's easier to get the big problems out of the way, then when it gets released to the masses, the smaller, often system-specific bugs can be discovered.

To those saying it's unfair, it's pretty standard in the software industry because it's really common sense. I'd like to hear your reasons why, other than 'because i want it first!'.

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tomek__w Newbie

tomek__w

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The 2.2 series was the first release that used private testers throughout. They all have to sign non-disclosure agreements and, by keeping the group small, we can get a bit more detailed with the problems they have or issues they notice.


Snipped a bit

In the end the private beta test group has been a great asset this time around and we are going to keep them around for the next series of IP.Board. They are already testing the latest builds of some of our yet to be released products.



In that case please forward my thanks (if they don't read this) to the 'private testers' for a job well done and keep up the good work - and of course to all the writers/developers.

I for one am certainly very appreciative of what they have done and are no doubt doing.
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tomek__w Newbie

tomek__w

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Actually the private testers post on this forum all the time. We don't keep them in a locked room and they can let you know who they are if they so choose :)



There are 40 or so if you're curious.



I figured as much

THANKS FOLKS, YOUR TIME AND EFFORT IS GREATLY APPRECIATED!!! :thumbsup:

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Mark Grand Master

Mark

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Ellawella, you are a class-A troll, it gets really annoying.




I prefer the term "opinionated".



We don't. We prefer the term "If you haven't got anything nice to say...." or simply "troll" works well.
Not nice being personally attacked is it?
And yeah, ok, you've never done it to me, but I'm fed up of watching you attack others, just because you've been here 3000 years doesn't make you better than us - heck, you're not even an IPS customer, what are you doing here!? Bugger off, you're act is getting old, and nobody's enjoying it.



Actually the private testers post on this forum all the time. We don't keep them in a locked room and they can let you know who they are if they so choose :)



There are 40 or so if you're curious.



They're everywhere :ph34r:

I respect selecting private testers too, but am saddened that I am never selected at the same time.


You have to apply, they did have an application form a little while ago
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bfarber Grand Master

bfarber

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...Maybe IPS should keep 3.x on the shush up until you guys are really really ready to release it for Beta testing, don't make no topics on the development/etc, don't be silly like Brandon (and team) and make a topic boasting about your upcoming new software, ...



Show me where I made a post in advance about the upcoming release, other than responding to bug reports or feature suggestions. ;) All of the official reports come via the special News account I don't have access to.

And quite realistically, if we DIDN'T have private testers, 2.2 would likely not be out yet. It would have been a mess dealing with the first stages, and then testing any "2.2.0 Beta2" type releases (sometimes, we make mistakes, and the upgrader or installer gets broken....it's better to have a team of 10 find this right away, than release a beta and have 500 come to you saying they can't install the beta).

I'm thankful for the private testers - this would have been sooo much harder without them. :thumbsup:
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Quillz Enthusiast

Quillz

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Posted

The 2.2 series was the first release that used private testers throughout. They all have to sign non-disclosure agreements and, by keeping the group small, we can get a bit more detailed with the problems they have or issues they notice.



One problem we have is that in reality no one

really

tests the product during a beta. Sure people click around and report bugs but it is not until the final is release and people truly start using things that you get a real feel for how stable the release is. As I mentioned on our company blog, we knew we would have to do a 2.2.1 soon after 2.2.0 because no matter what you do

something

always comes up once the masses start using a release.



In the end the private beta test group has been a great asset this time around and we are going to keep them around for the next series of IP.Board. They are already testing the latest builds of some of our yet to be released products.


Can you please allow for new private beta testers in the future? I'd like to be a beta tester for 3.0.
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Antony Newbie

Antony

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Show me where I made a post in advance about the upcoming release, other than responding to bug reports or feature suggestions. ;) All of the official reports come via the special News account I don't have access to.



And quite realistically, if we DIDN'T have private testers, 2.2 would likely not be out yet. It would have been a mess dealing with the first stages, and then testing any "2.2.0 Beta2" type releases (sometimes, we make mistakes, and the upgrader or installer gets broken....it's better to have a team of 10 find this right away, than release a beta and have 500 come to you saying they can't install the beta).



I'm thankful for the private testers - this would have been sooo much harder without them. :thumbsup:


I think he meant Brandon of Invisionfree as opposed to yourself. :)
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ellawella Explorer

ellawella

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We don't. We prefer the term "If you haven't got anything nice to say...." or simply "troll" works well.


Not nice being personally attacked is it?


And yeah, ok, you've never done it to me, but I'm fed up of watching you attack others, just because you've been here 3000 years doesn't make you better than us - heck, you're not even an IPS customer, what are you doing here!? Bugger off, you're act is getting old, and nobody's enjoying it.


Nice job assuming you speak for everyone.

"Act"?? I speak my mind. Reflect on what about that causes you to feel threatened. 3000 years???? I've not been here long at all; just 6 months more than you.

I am no longer a customer, but continue to be an admin of a site running an IPB. We alternate licences from year to year, so I may yet become a customer again. In the meantime, I'll carry on as I left off until someone of significance directs me otherwise. If you hate me that much, make use of your ignore list and the problem is solved.
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