Apps/plugins and Invision Community 5

[Matt]

Hi all,

This is just a quick post to let you know that while stand-alone plug-ins are deprecated in version 5, there is no need to convert your plugins to applications right now.

There are significant changes coming to how third party templates and code interacts with the v5 framework changes which means any plug-in or application will need a lot of work for Invision Community 5. Simply converting a plug-in into an app won't future proof it, so it is a waste of your time at this point.

We're in the very early stages of making these framework changes but will get information to you as soon as we have everything figured out.

Also a reminder that v4 will have a multi-year deprecation, and we expect to work on both v4 and v5 for quite a while with a fairly slow migration over to v5 for the first chapter of its life, so I would think the majority of sales would still come from v4 for at least another year or so.

Thanks!

[Nathan Explosion]

While there is no 'need', we can do it if we wish though - I've had the time in April to do this, so getting something that I've planned anyway out of the way. Makes it easier for me.

 

[Stuart Silvester]

Sure you can go ahead and do it, but sit on releasing it until you have something meaningful to include. Whether that be bug fixes or enhancements. Releasing only this change is a waste of time for our reviewers and for customers.

[IPCommerceFan]

Thanks for the heads up!

[Princess Celestia]

@Matt: The deprecation tracker currently says:

Quote

Any existing plugins can easily be ported to applications and we encourage third-parties to start the process as soon as possible.

If converting plugins to applications now in preparation for v5 is a waste of time as you say, you may wish to clarify the guidance on the deprecation tracker, which makes it sound worth going out of one's way to do ASAP. 🙂

[shahed]

i think this part is more important for me to know. and thanks for letting us know.

21 hours ago, Matt said:

Also a reminder that v4 will have a multi-year deprecation, and we expect to work on both v4 and v5 for quite a while with a fairly slow migration over to v5 for the first chapter of its life, so I would think the majority of sales would still come from v4 for at least another year or so.

i have practically abandoned a half-baked set of new templates for Pages app after the "V5 plugin-defunct" news. didn't know if it's worth to continue since aside all re-work and more re-work for V5, more important question for me was at the end, this resource meant to be sold for how long at all. so you know... better wait to continue at the start of V5. knowing this slow migration to V5 make me to re-schedule times to resume this as soon as possible. really good decision so thanks for that as well. 👍

Also Pages app will be around for V5 i assume? 😁

[Randy Calvert]

Yes, Pages will continue in v5!  🙂 

[Matt]

11 hours ago, Princess Celestia said:

@Matt: The deprecation tracker currently says:

If converting plugins to applications now in preparation for v5 is a waste of time as you say, you may wish to clarify the guidance on the deprecation tracker, which makes it sound worth going out of one's way to do ASAP. 🙂

That's correct, v5 won't have a concept of stand-alone plug-ins. But there's two things to keep in mind:

1) v5 will have numerous changes to how applications are developed (significant changes to template hooks and code hooks)
2) v4 will still allow plugins, and will be supported and heavily used for at least a few more years.

So moving plug-ins into applications for v4 is a waste of time unless you have a major update or other compelling reason. Just moving the code from a plug-in into an app because a different version of the software with a different set of development tools won't support plug-ins is not helping you or us.

Moving v4 code based plug-ins into applications for v5 will not help, as the code will not work with v5, so right now it's a waste of time.

[The Old Man]

Thanks for the heads up!

Perhaps a page for V5 we could Follow would be useful, to keep track of things, like a bullet list or something.

Will V5 still use PHP? Will we need to learn significantly new coding for the new v5 framework?

[Randy Calvert]

12 hours ago, The Old Man said:

Will V5 still use PHP? Will we need to learn significantly new coding for the new v5 framework?

It has been confirmed that v5 will use PHP.  I can’t comment on the second question, but at least I can at least answer the first!

[Marc]

20 hours ago, The Old Man said:

Will V5 still use PHP?

Amongst other things as it does now, yes. There are actually rumours that we will be plugging directly into Matts mind for some of the more advanced features, but I feel those rumours may be greatly exaggerated.

20 hours ago, The Old Man said:

Will we need to learn significantly new coding for the new v5 framework?

We will provide more information on how development will work within the v4 framework in due course, but there will be changes to how this works 

[The Old Man]

Okay thanks Marc.

[Matt]

PHP 8.1 (8.2 compatible) will be the version minimum.

You won't need to re-learn everything, it's not a complete rewrite.

Some things to keep in mind:

We import namespaces so we no longer use fully qualified names. What does this mean?

Old:

namespace IPS\foo

class foo
{
	function _construct()
	{
		if ( \IPS\Member::i()->isAdmin() )
		{
			$this->bar = \IPS\Request::i()->input;
		}
	}
}

New:

namespace IPS\foo

use IPS\Member;
use IPS\Request;

class foo
{
	function _construct()
	{
		if ( Member::i()->isAdmin() )
		{
			$this->bar = Request::i()->input;
		}
	}
}

You *could* use FQN but we no longer do that. The result is a lot neater.

We have also moved most Content interfaces into traits (where it makes sense) and we've introduced a few new dev tools which we'll speak about very soon.

So it's really about cleaning up existing code and moving existing hooks, etc into the new dev tools.

You're not starting from scratch again.

I'll be working on some new dev blogs to go through all the changes in a bit more detail hopefully later this month.

[Miss_B]

Thank you for the example code and the explanation @Matt. Looking forward to the new dev blocks. 

[teraßyte]

7 minutes ago, Matt said:

PHP 8.1 (8.2 compatible) will be the version minimum.

You won't need to re-learn everything, it's not a complete rewrite.

Some things to keep in mind:

We import namespaces so we no longer use fully qualified names. What does this mean?

Old:

namespace IPS\foo

class foo
{
	function _construct()
	{
		if ( \IPS\Member::i()->isAdmin() )
		{
			$this->bar = \IPS\Request::i()->input;
		}
	}
}

New:

namespace IPS\foo

use IPS\Member;
use IPS\Request;

class foo
{
	function _construct()
	{
		if ( Member::i()->isAdmin() )
		{
			$this->bar = Request::i()->input;
		}
	}
}

You *could* use FQN but we no longer do that. The result is a lot neater.

We have also moved most Content interfaces into traits (where it makes sense) and we've introduced a few new dev tools which we'll speak about very soon.

So it's really about cleaning up existing code and moving existing hooks, etc into the new dev tools.

You're not starting from scratch again.

I'll be working on some new dev blogs to go through all the changes in a bit more detail hopefully later this month.

 

@Matt Traits... huh? In that case, please be sure to have a look at this topic:

 

We need a solution to that. The only option currently is to add very specific checks based on URLs, and it doesn't work for every situation, either.

 

[Adriano Faria]

7 minutes ago, teraßyte said:

 

@Matt Traits... huh? In that case, please be sure to have a look at this topic:

 

We need a solution to that. The only option currently is to add very specific checks based on URLs, and it doesn't work for every situation, either.

 

Yep, I didn't want to be the guy that points the finger, but I hope IPS is taking this in consideration.

[Daniel F]

Yes, we have a solution for this!

[Adriano Faria]

Hook points?

[GoGators]

Will v5 require a new purchase or will v4 owners receive the upgrade?

[Matt]

We continue to offer major upgrades to active license holders. We do not require a purchase of a new license.

47 minutes ago, Daniel F said:

Yes, we have a solution for this!

44 minutes ago, Adriano Faria said:

Hook points?

Better.

[Mike G.]

I know absolutely nothing about development, but this has been a fun follow. Thanks for the continuous transparency and updates as things are being finalized.

[Matt]

I'd like to say more but we really want to present the entire package so it all makes sense.

I also want to say that while I often talk about the new stuff we do, it's the product of a very hard working team. We have had input from multiple stakeholders, including those who use the v4 dev tools daily, when designing the new development tools.

[galenb]

So as a software developer with 20 years experience, 5 of those in PHP a few years ago, who was about to start learning development techniques for IPS... I should just wait for Version 5 to release?

[Marc]

There will be significant changes and different ways of working within version 5. However, there would always be things you can learn by coding items for version 4. So it would be your own choice really. 

[The Old Man]

Hi,

Re: Plugin EOL for v5...

Is there any major reason for this? It seems less than ideal to build a full app if you just want to add or change something small. Wouldn't having to build dozens of apps for everything big, medium or small slow down the suite?

Thanks.