So, how does IPS deal with the tracker?

[Adriano Faria]

Yes, we all wait replies like that, Charles. :)

If it's good to IPS, nice for IPS. For me and for several other users, don't. I stopped report bugs, just like Michael. Other probably will stop too... Honestly I don't see end user creating issues; just a VERY few.

In the end, this is bad for IPS (which will always lost users on tests and will end up on buggy releases), not for me, which I'm only one in a million here.

:)

[Dmacleo]

you asked why its not liked.

you were told why its not liked.

not liking the answer as to why its not liked isn't really likeable :)

[Charles]

I am just telling you why it is the way it is. It works for us and it's IPS that works with it day in and day out :)

[Adriano Faria]

someone who often searches the tracker, I can't see #3 to be true at all. As for #2, if I want to search for something in JUST IP.Content, I click the IP.Content category, type in my search term, and it searches IP.Content only. The same is true for any app, and mainly how I use the tracker search system.

VIEW NEW CONTENT -> BUG TRACKER COMMENTS. Are you saying that this doesn't load slow?

Click the comment date. It's the global comments system. :thumbsup:

Didn't know that. :)

[Dmacleo]

I am just telling you why it is the way it is. It works for us and it's IPS that works with it day in and day out :smile:

mostly based on reports users file.

if nobody ever files anything how useful is it?

the older system was easier for many to use.

make it work well for everyone and you can show off the product (ip.content) too, make it work only for you and everyone will suffer IMO.

[Ryan H.]

Our bug tracker is a tool for us to fix issues in the software and we implement in a way that makes sense for how we work. Pretty and good feeling are not on the to do list for a tool like this :smile:

That's fine if that's how you feel about it, but don't expect anyone else to actually use it. You're ignoring alternate use cases.

[Charles]

I would honestly love suggestions on how we could make submitting a bug any easier: http://screencast.com/t/TtjPumxuGSce

[Lavo]

The only thing I can add to this is that It should be designed more for the end user and not really what suits/works for you. You rely upon end users submitting bugs, you need to make this as easily attractive to them as possible.

I would honestly love suggestions on how we could make submitting a bug any easier: http://screencast.com/t/TtjPumxuGSce

Emulate the look and feel of the old tracker in ip.content?

[Charles]

The only thing I can add to this is that It should be designed more for the end user and not really what suits/works for you. You rely upon end users submitting bugs, you need to make this as easily attractive to them as possible.

Emulate the look and feel of the old tracker in ip.content?

Can you better explain what was easier about that when submitting a bug? As I recall the process was pretty much identical.

[Dmacleo]

7. That will change with 4.0. Temporary thing for now.

this item is one of the biggest things, but if temporary not much you can do.

other tracker allowed users to confirm they had the issue, I see no way to do that now. its a small item but some liked that.

when used properly gave a good idea of scope of issue w/o tons of "me too" replies.

[Lavo]

Can you better explain what was easier about that when submitting a bug? As I recall the process was pretty much identical

The most recent version was pre-selected and the look was little more streamlined, in my opinion.(I'm not that great at describing so forgive me :P)

And on a side note when viewing an issue, you lost probably the most single useful feature in the tracker which was the Issue confirmations box.

[TSP]

1. We like it this way. The last person to post a comment is not relevant information to us when fixing bugs.

Well, it confuses me personally when it's not there. Sometimes I'm not really sure if I've read something or not. It was a nice sort of confirmation pointer. (Yes, I do know about the read/unread marker, but that doesn't always do it for me)

And if I had been IPS Staff, I think I would've viewed it as helpful information aswell. When you mark a bug as "Cannot reproduce" for example and I make a new reply to it, it feels like it will probarbly just go unnoticed if a post a new reply to it. Because other IPB staff will see the issue on the index and think "I dont have to read that then". Then you're sort of dependent on the original developer who answered coming back to notice that there is a new reply and read it.

That might not be the truth and you might have some internal guidelines or double checking in place to avoid that, but the feeling of uncertainty is still there.

2. That's something we can look into improving in a future version of IP.Content.

Good, I'm currently being extremely confused by the search myself. And often if I search for something, it doesn't work properly when I do a new one.

5. It works fine for me. If you need help we can post a video perhaps?

I don't think a video should be needed in order to explain how something like that works to experienced users. That would be the indicator that the user experience is not great.

I do understand how it works myself, but the behaviour is kind of limited. If you choose version to be 3.3.4 and choose fixed you get all bugs that are fixed that were reported with the 3.3.4 version. But what if you want to see all issues fixed for 3.4? Some of them would've been reported with 3.3.3 version etc.

6. None of that is important information for a bug tracker.

While I do understand your logic in what you're saying here, I do not agree that it's a good reason to omit the information. I've pointed out some of the reason in the first point.

Our bug tracker is a tool for us to fix issues in the software and we implement in a way that makes sense for how we work. Pretty and good feeling are not on the to do list for a tool like this :smile:

I really think it should be. I've not really been tempted to submit bug reports lately myself. I'll agree it should be a tool where you feel it's suited for fixing bugs, but it should be a tool where you get as many bugs as possible to be reported aswell. ;)

Another issue I have is when I click "View new content". It just sorts bug reports by submit date and I'm frustrated every time I click it and have to remind myself that it doesn't actually show new content in the way it used to anymore.

And don't tell me it's easy to get bug reports I've submitted or replied in My Content. That's hidden away.

[Lavo]

Can you better explain what was easier about that when submitting a bug? As I recall the process was pretty much identical.

Also, only versions specific to the project (Or in this case category) was shown. Not all of them which is probably the main confusion point.

[Mark]

Well, it confuses me personally when it's not there. Sometimes I'm not really sure if I've read something or not. It was a nice sort of confirmation pointer. (Yes, I do know about the read/unread marker, but that doesn't always do it for me)

And if I had been IPS Staff, I think I would've viewed it as helpful information aswell. When you mark a bug as "Cannot reproduce" for example and I make a new reply to it, it feels like it will probarbly just go unnoticed if a post a new reply to it. Because other IPB staff will see the issue on the index and think "I dont have to read that then". Then you're sort of dependent on the original developer who answered coming back to notice that there is a new reply and read it.

That might not be the truth and you might have some internal guidelines or double checking in place to avoid that, but the feeling of uncertainty is still there.

We look at the unread marker on the left ;)

[Rimi]

The only thing I can add to this is that It should be designed more for the end user and not really what suits/works for you.

It really shouldn't. IPS should develop a bug tracker that caters to their needs and that's exactly what they did. Anyone who's refusing to report bugs simply because they lack higher order thinking skills needs to get a reality check. The bug tracker isn't made for them, it's made for IPS. lol

You can be as stubborn as you want, but the fact is that the people who the bug tracker was actually made for have no need for the features you're requesting. If you don't want to report bugs out of spite then that's on you.

[Adriano Faria]

We look at the unread marker on the left ;)

Yeah, that one that isn't a link.

[Aiwa]

The only issues I have with the IP.Content tracker is the broken historical data, all attachments lost, and the follow system.

When you submit a bug, you are not auto followed like you are in the forums. You have to explicitly follow the report after that. While it's a tiny issue, it's one that affects the user reporting the bug that can slow down the response to a report if the reporting user doesn't know there is a reply because they forgot to hit 'follow'.

There is no need to show who made the last comment... That's not relevant information... And the top post of the bug report has the status, fixed, duplicate, version, etc... There's no need for that 'tracker' sidebar... If you have the same issue, why don't you just 'follow' the report so you can keep track of it and get a fix, or know when a fix will be released... I only ever saw that 'i have the issue too' button clicked by a handful of people and it's actually not relevant. A bug was reported and the bug will be fixed. IPS can determine the priority of the bugs themselves without people poking the listing saying, 'Hey, i have the issue too'... If IPS can't duplicate, that's when you pipe up with more information to help get the bug solved...

I agree with some of the earlier comments about needing to make things easier for the reporter not only in submitting the report, which is as easy as it gets, but also being notified that there is additional information required, follow notifications.

[Lavo]

It really shouldn't. IPS should develop a bug tracker that caters to their needs and that's exactly what they did. Anyone who's refusing to report bugs simply because they lack higher order thinking skills needs to get a reality check. The bug tracker isn't made for them, it's made for IPS. lol

You can be as stubborn as you want, but the fact is that the people who the bug tracker was actually made for have no need for the features you're requesting. If you don't want to report bugs out of spite then that's on you.

I do report bugs when I find them.

My entire goal in programming/displaying to put the user first not myself. It's true they aren't needed, but they are useful to some. As a developer I find that the "Issue confirmations" is really helpful in determining if it's a one user thing, such as a browser cache issue, or affecting multiple users which decides it's priority to how fast it gets fixed and patch out. It also helps out the user to know they aren't the only one with this problem, or that they are the only one and might want to check over their configuration.

[Alfa1]

I can't figure out for the life of me how to find all open bugs in IPS or even IPB.

Can someone show me?

[bfarber]

this item is one of the biggest things, but if temporary not much you can do.

other tracker allowed users to confirm they had the issue, I see no way to do that now. its a small item but some liked that.

when used properly gave a good idea of scope of issue w/o tons of "me too" replies.

The most recent version was pre-selected and the look was little more streamlined, in my opinion.(I'm not that great at describing so forgive me :tongue:)

And on a side note when viewing an issue, you lost probably the most single useful feature in the tracker which was the Issue confirmations box.

The screenshot there says it all really. The feature was almost NEVER used, and extremely rarely referenced by staff here. In other words, it was useless, and why spend time recreating something that was virtually never used? Even when users had the same issue, they'd just reply to the report (if they were inclined to do anything) and say "me too".

Yeah, that one that isn't a link.

This is something we will improve in IP.Content. It's a relatively minor thing, but we are working towards making the system much more consistent with the forums, as evidenced by the last several releases.

The only issues I have with the IP.Content tracker is the broken historical data, all attachments lost, and the follow system.

When you submit a bug, you are not auto followed like you are in the forums. You have to explicitly follow the report after that. While it's a tiny issue, it's one that affects the user reporting the bug that can slow down the response to a report if the reporting user doesn't know there is a reply because they forgot to hit 'follow'.

There is no need to show who made the last comment... That's not relevant information... And the top post of the bug report has the status, fixed, duplicate, version, etc... There's no need for that 'tracker' sidebar... If you have the same issue, why don't you just 'follow' the report so you can keep track of it and get a fix, or know when a fix will be released... I only ever saw that 'i have the issue too' button clicked by a handful of people and it's actually not relevant. A bug was reported and the bug will be fixed. IPS can determine the priority of the bugs themselves without people poking the listing saying, 'Hey, i have the issue too'... If IPS can't duplicate, that's when you pipe up with more information to help get the bug solved...

I agree with some of the earlier comments about needing to make things easier for the reporter not only in submitting the report, which is as easy as it gets, but also being notified that there is additional information required, follow notifications.

The autofollow bit is also something we are working on, not just in Content but in all of our apps. It has already been improved in some of them, and we will continue making updates to auto-following suite-wide.

I can't figure out for the life of me how to find all open bugs in IPS or even IPB.

Can someone show me?

We have a few statuses that are "open".

http://screencast.com/t/XrvKtYJUB

[Alfa1]

Thanks. How do I replicate the tracker in IP.Content? Is there a tutorial somewhere?

[Marcher Technologies]

I am just telling you why it is the way it is. It works for us and it's IPS that works with it day in and day out :smile:

BZZZT.

Wrong answer. You depend on us quite often to report bugs that have slipped through, or that do not affect your usage.

I argue we use it more than you do, and while I still report bugs I find, this database is not very user-friendly for this specific need.

Less user-friendly does in fact mean less people will report or keep up with bugs, which leads directly to a decline in quality.

[Adriano Faria]

BZZZT.
Wrong answer. You depend on us quite often to report bugs that have slipped through, or that do not affect your usage.
I argue we use it more than you do, and while I still report bugs I find, this database is not very user-friendly for this specific need.
Less user-friendly does in fact mean less people will report or keep up with bugs, which leads directly to a decline in quality.

PERFECT! That's exacly what I tried to express here

:)

[TSP]

<p>&nbsp;</p>
<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="Marcher Technologies" data-cid="2337041" data-time="1353976722">
<p>I argue <em>we </em>use it more than you do, and while I still report bugs I find, this database is not very user-friendly for this specific need.</p>
<p>Less user-friendly does in fact mean less people will report or keep up with bugs, which leads directly to a decline in quality.</p>
</blockquote>
<p>&nbsp;</p>
<p>Agreed.&nbsp;</p>
<p>&nbsp;</p>
<p>The fact is, while I personally do report bugs now.. I really find no &quot;joy&quot; or ease of use with it like before. It's not consistent with the overall forum look and I'm just being demotivated by looking at it. It feels more like an job now I guess, it's more like &quot;I have to do it&quot;, instead of &quot;I want to do it&quot;. It's not like I'm looking because I just have some free time to kill anymore.&nbsp;</p>
<p>&nbsp;</p>
<p>Before I found it a breeze to look through replies to bug reports many days back, now I find it cumbersome.&nbsp;</p>
<p>&nbsp;</p>
<p>I'm not necessarily saying that the process of creating bug reports is any harder than it was... But I don't know.. Maybe the whole design thing is what &nbsp;killing it for me, but I just find it harder to browse and use it in general now which in turn just makes me hate the whole system.&nbsp;</p>
<p>&nbsp;</p>
<p>Tools like VNC, My Content, go to last unread and understanding how the searched worked. All felt better before.&nbsp;</p>


<p>^<br />
<br />
Lol, editor issue, again. I'm not writing that thing again. Will copy link to reply in tracker:&nbsp;http://community.invisionpower.com/resources/bugs.html/_/ip-board/html-from-editor-r40013</p>

[Rimi]

I agree guys. Reporting bugs is not worth my time if I can't have a fun, and easy time doing it. If there's no thrill in filling out the same exact form I fill out when I make an article then I don't wish to be a part of such an obviously flawed system. I WANT TO FEEL THE JOY OF SUBMITTING BUGS! MAKE ME HAPPY IPS!!

@Matt - This is sarcasm. You're supposed to laugh.

One thing to note that you guys might be overlooking is that sometimes bugs are found in tickets and they get fixed without ever making it to the tracker. So if aesthetics of submitting bug reports is an issue for you then just submit a ticket. That's a pretty sexy layout.