How to Shut Off Admin Upgrade Notice?

[AlexWebsites]

Does anyone know how to shut off the upgrade notice on the site to admins? I can deal with the ACP notices, but not the live site every time I login. 

I close it but it comes back on my next visit....lol. I'm not ready to move to 4.5 yet.

[CoffeeCake]

After looking for this, I determined through careful testing that if I unplugged the server, I stopped seeing the message.

[Fast Lane!]

41 minutes ago, AlexWebsites said:

Does anyone know how to shut off the upgrade notice on the site to admins? I can deal with the ACP notices, but not the live site every time I login. 

I close it but it comes back on my next visit....lol. I'm not ready to move to 4.5 yet.

Yeah kinda annoying. Not planning to upgrade for at least 6 months. 

[bearback]

i have asked about this also,  could do with this disabling.

 it is getting really annoying, cannot upgrade at moment. 

[Rhett]

This notice is there for a reason, it's simple to remove and all automated, just upgrade!

If you can't upgrade for some reason, we would recommend you find the cause of that and resolve it so you can.

We do not allow code or plugins to remove this item though.

It's in your best interest to be on the latest version for your security, peace of mind, and to ensure upgrades go smoothly.  Skipping many versions can often cause unneeded issues when you do upgrade.

 

 

 

 

[Fast Lane!]

3 hours ago, Rhett said:

This notice is there for a reason, it's simple to remove and all automated, just upgrade!

If you can't upgrade for some reason, we would recommend you find the cause of that and resolve it so you can.

We do not allow code or plugins to remove this item though.

It's in your best interest to be on the latest version for your security, peace of mind, and to ensure upgrades go smoothly.  Skipping many versions can often cause unneeded issues when you do upgrade.

 

 

 

 

I think many of us are sitting back while the kinks get worked out of the new version. No major reasons to rush. 

[Jock3r]

I have to say that this message is also annoying me. Do not get me wrong, I do plan to upgrade but not yet, since I mostly use custom applications and theme. They would all have to be updated for 4.5 and that's gonna take some time as devs are pilled up with stuff due to corona and due to other orders. I would also want to know if there is any way to hide that.

[_Vault_]

A simple checkbox to acknowledge the message for this release would be good, I agree. It can show up again, when the next version has been released. Don’t think an admin is going to forget about it...

[pauldaytona]

I suppose a partly new language translation is needed for me, then have to make a new skin, and the 5 plugins/ applications we use don't have the 4.5 status yet.  I the mean time I have to look at an annoying message each time. I'm running now for 16 years this Invision board but can't remember Having this sort of message before. 

[xtech]

The message is extremely annoying. I believe this is deliberate to force users to upgrade, but they can only do it if they have any active subscription.

I hope you (IPS) understand that you cannot force upgrade throat down on the people. Admins are not willing to keep upgrading every minor update, they have more things to do.. like running their communities. Other times they depend on 3rd party apps that don't get updated so soon. Please be Nice to your customers and allow the notice to be dismissable. You can remember the user from time to time (it can even appear every time we log in to ACP, but please make it dismissable), but nagging the users like this, with a non dismissable message that takes 20% of the screen just shows a total lack of respect for your users and clearly shows you want to force them to do something. 

Yes, yes... I know... Security reasons, updates and whatever... we all know that, nobody is stupid. Everyone knows the risks of not upgrading, self hosting admins have enough knowledge of that.

 

Lets be honest and straight to the point: at the end of the day, we all know that the main reason for annoying the users like this is to keep the money flowing in. We are fine with that, that's why we are buying and keeping licenses with IPS. But...

...stop bugging your customers.

We can easily defeat the message with some template editing or browser script, yet as a matter of principle, please respect your customers by giving the users the options to dismiss the warning.

Edited October 18, 2020 by xtech

[xtech]

On 10/16/2020 at 6:04 AM, Rhett said:

It's in your best interest to be on the latest version for your security, peace of mind

No, it is not.

It is on the best interest of IPS to keep the money flow. The interest of users is to be able to upgrade when they want, not when you want them to upgrade. Do you always reboot Windows when there is an upgrade available? Ir do you choose to do it when it better suits you?

I hate when companies try to disguise business reasons with "user needs". Be truthful, be respectful. 

I would gladly accept the justification that "IPS is a company that dependes on active license income, and as such we want out customers to have an active licence." Euphemisms like "we would recommend you find the cause of that and resolve it so you can."  are just a way of saying "pay you license fees". I don't understand why you want to hide what is visible to everyone (and understandable, we all know you have a business to run). It is not correct of you, sorry, and your users deserve more respect.

 

On 10/16/2020 at 6:04 AM, Rhett said:

We do not allow code or plugins to remove this item though.

Yes. But users may do what they want with their browser scripting, so they are entitled to hide that info in client side if they want. Do you  honestly think that showing a notice that takes 20% of the screen, reducing the code editors to a couple if lines is a reasonable and good faith practice?

If you do not find find a solution for this, i will myself publish a browser extension to end this for good.

Edited October 18, 2020 by xtech

[jair101]

Want to jump in here as well. There are A LOT of very VALID reasons to postpone the upgrade - custom themes, 3rd party app/plugins, language translations and so on and so on. Frankly, this:

On 10/16/2020 at 8:04 AM, Rhett said:

If you can't upgrade for some reason, we would recommend you find the cause of that and resolve it so you can.

is insulting. I found the reason - the apps I use are not updated yet, those that are done I have not finished testing, I still need to translate > 100 pages of new language strings and on top of that your brand new releases are typically unstable, so it makes sense to wait at least a few months for everything to settle down. What should I do to resolve it? Duh!

[Runar]

On 10/16/2020 at 7:04 AM, Rhett said:

If you can't upgrade for some reason, we would recommend you find the cause of that and resolve it so you can.

As others have already mentioned, it's not always that simple. I help manage one of the larger communities, with over 25 million posts running on multiple servers, and upgrading to a new version involves long periods of testing. When we actually do upgrade, it's a complicated process to prevent messing something up for our thousands of members.

I completely understand that you want everyone to be using the most recent version, but there are several valid reasons for not upgrading immediately after a new release.

[Dll]

56 minutes ago, Runar said:

As others have already mentioned, it's not always that simple. I help manage one of the larger communities, with over 25 million posts running on multiple servers, and upgrading to a new version involves long periods of testing. When we actually do upgrade, it's a complicated process to prevent messing something up for our thousands of members.

I completely understand that you want everyone to be using the most recent version, but there are several valid reasons for not upgrading immediately after a new release.

To be fair, you've had a long time to test - the beta process went on for months, and the full release has been available for over a month now too. So, if you've not got round to it yet then that's still the issue, rather than an admin banner being visible.

[Runar]

2 minutes ago, Dll said:

To be fair, you've had a long time to test - the beta process went on for months, and the full release has been available for over a month now too. So, if you've not got round to it yet then that's still the issue, rather than an admin banner being visible.

You're correct, and personally I'd like to see the community I referred to updated more frequently. However, updating during the beta period is not really an option, as things change quite often and things can and will break.

Another point is that some updates require you to make changes on the server side. For instance, 4.5 recommends PHP version 7.4 and future versions of Invision Community will drop support for older versions of PHP. Yes, I know PHP 7.2 is three years old and that you should keep your servers up to date as well, but realistically that's not always possible.

Finally — and this is something I don't think anyone can argue against — some people simply don't want to update. Apple doesn't force their users to update their iPhones and iPads to the latest version of iOS. Sure, they recommend it and more and more apps will stop working on older versions of iOS, but you don't get a banner taking up half the screen everywhere if you're on an older version.

[Dll]

1 hour ago, Runar said:

You're correct, and personally I'd like to see the community I referred to updated more frequently. However, updating during the beta period is not really an option, as things change quite often and things can and will break.

Another point is that some updates require you to make changes on the server side. For instance, 4.5 recommends PHP version 7.4 and future versions of Invision Community will drop support for older versions of PHP. Yes, I know PHP 7.2 is three years old and that you should keep your servers up to date as well, but realistically that's not always possible.

Finally — and this is something I don't think anyone can argue against — some people simply don't want to update. Apple doesn't force their users to update their iPhones and iPads to the latest version of iOS. Sure, they recommend it and more and more apps will stop working on older versions of iOS, but you don't get a banner taking up half the screen everywhere if you're on an older version.

If you need a period of testing, then the beta releases are a good place to start, surely? Assuming when you say testing, you mean creating a test forum, copying the database etc. 

The argument about not wanting to update is a dangerous one - where do draw the line? Do you want to keep a version of php on your server with security exploits, do you want to keep a version of forum software running which may not be getting security updates and so on? When it comes to your iphone, it's your choice and affects only you should there be some sort of security issue or things not working as expected. When you're running a web server, it's a bigger responsibility since you're looking after all of your users too.

I'm guessing if you publicised the fact that due to the fact you've not got round to what could be vital upgrades, you may be using out of date software (and not just invision, potentially) which could have security implications, your members may not be especially happy?

For instance, here's the list of security vulnerabilities in PHP 7.2

https://www.cvedetails.com/vulnerability-list/vendor_id-74/product_id-128/version_id-235668/PHP-PHP-7.2.0.html

So again, I don't see the banner as the issue here, and frankly nor should you.

 

Edited October 19, 2020 by Dll

[Runar]

33 minutes ago, Dll said:

If you need a period of testing, then the beta releases are a good place to start, surely? Assuming when you say testing, you mean creating a test forum, copying the database etc. 

Creating a test forum and copying the production database is not that simple when you've got tens of millions of rows in several of the database tables. Not to mention the test environment should be as close to the production environment as possible, which might require additional expensive hardware. All this requires someone to do the work, and in many cases it ends up being a question about who pays for what (and what is pushed to the back of the queue due to money going to testing). In an optimal scenario testing would be the norm and money wouldn't be an issue, but unfortunately this is not always the case.

37 minutes ago, Dll said:

The argument about not wanting to update is a dangerous one - where do draw the line? Do you want to keep a version of php on your server with security exploits, do you want to keep a version of forum software running which may not be getting security updates and so on? When it comes to your iphone, it's your choice and affects only you should there be some sort of security issue or things not working as expected. When you're running a web server, it's a bigger responsibility since you're looking after all of your users too.

I don't know where to draw the line myself. I understand your points of view and I agree with most of them, so I might be playing the devil's advocate here. PHP and other server software can be patched without updating to newer full releases. In some cases there are patches released for Invision Community as well, and the most serious security issues would be disclosed so one could – though not recommended – manually fix the security issues without updating. With that being said, the best and simplest thing is to update.

42 minutes ago, Dll said:

I'm guessing if you publicised the fact that due to the fact you've not got round to what could be vital upgrades, you may be using out of date software (and not just invision, potentially) which could have security implications, your members may not be especially happy?

I honestly don't think most members of online communities care. If you know what Invision Community is, you'll quickly recognize communities running on older versions, at least on versions 4.4 and earlier. The differences in functionality and design are quite significant, even on communities using custom themes. All members care about is performance and functionality, and that nothing breaks when something is updated. I also don't think someone is trying to hide the fact that they're not using the most recent version.

I would just like to add that I personally try to update (all software) as soon as possible after a new release. What I'm trying to say here is that I understand why some don't update immediately, and that I get the most common reasons for not doing so. I don't disagree with you that the banner is not the main issue. What I meant with my original comment was that Rhett's wording could have been better, as the causes of many not updating immediately is known, but not necessarily quickly resolved.

[Fast Lane!]

On 10/19/2020 at 1:45 AM, Dll said:

To be fair, you've had a long time to test - the beta process went on for months, and the full release has been available for over a month now too. So, if you've not got round to it yet then that's still the issue, rather than an admin banner being visible.

Why would folks test a beta version that isn't final.  Why would anyone test the first several .x.y versions either. Much smarter to let it stabilize and then test.  This is how most large business do things to prevent disruptions. 

[opentype]

37 minutes ago, Fast Lane! said:

Why would folks test a beta version that isn't final.  Why would anyone test the first several .x.y versions either. Much smarter to let it stabilize and then test. 

That isn’t logically sound. The entire point of a beta program is to have the external testers to spot potential problems with their usage. If no one participates (as this is supposedly the “smart” thing to to do), then the beta program wouldn’t reveal any problems and nothing could “stabilize”. So questioning people’s participation, which is the very thing that leads to the stabilization, is kind of weird. 

Edited October 21, 2020 by opentype

[Dll]

3 hours ago, Fast Lane! said:

Why would folks test a beta version that isn't final.  Why would anyone test the first several .x.y versions either. Much smarter to let it stabilize and then test.  This is how most large business do things to prevent disruptions. 

Not quite. Most large businesses use beta tests to test. That doesn't mean they necessarily use them live, but will test new software on development servers.

Edited October 21, 2020 by Dll

[xtech]

4 hours ago, opentype said:

The entire point of a beta program is to have the external testers to spot potential problems with their usage.

Yes, but if we are talking about paid software, i wound't expect that people would work for free for a company, sacrificing their resources to test for a company who charges them money for the software. 

IPS is not offering their software for free or making any discount to beta testers, either.

[opentype]

1 minute ago, xtech said:

Yes, but if we are talking about paid software, i wound't expect that people would work for free for a company …

You might not “expect” it, but it is happening and so there also isn’t really a point made here. Instead of money, people can have other motivations to take part in beta programs. 

[Morrigan]

I'm a beta tester! Have been for years!!!

[Arthmoor]

On 10/15/2020 at 11:04 PM, Rhett said:

This notice is there for a reason, it's simple to remove and all automated, just upgrade!

If you can't upgrade for some reason, we would recommend you find the cause of that and resolve it so you can.

 

 

 

 

 

I'd suggest caution - this kind of flippant attitude toward the customer base is why people seek out alternatives. Even if those alternatives aren't as robust.

[Rhett]

7 hours ago, Arthmoor said:

I'd suggest caution - this kind of flippant attitude toward the customer base is why people seek out alternatives. Even if those alternatives aren't as robust.

Hello, this isn't a " flippant attitude" at all, please don't take it that way.  

This topic has been covered several times however, and management has made the decision that this alert will not be removed, we show this for security and the customers best interest in mind, we are not being selfish, we are not being flippant, and we are not being pushy with this recommendation.  If third party items are holding some back from upgrading, perhaps they need to evaluate how much value that item is brining to the community if it's forcing them to remain out of date.   That isn't an item which we can answer for you though, that is your decision.  

With that said, there really isn't much more to add to this topic, so I will close this up.  If anyone has anything further to add on this subject and you feel it's something you want addressed that hasn't been converged already, please submit a support ticket under your account.

 

Thank you for your understanding.