Hump Day: A Refresh Has Arrived!

[kims79]

Il y a 3 minutes, Matt a dit :

Vous pouvez essayer notre forfait de démarrage, qui coûte 49 $ / mois. Vous n’aurez pas besoin de gérer les internes, nous faisons tout cela pour vous. Ce sera une chose de moins à vous soucier afin que vous puissiez concentrer toute votre attention sur la croissance et la direction de votre communauté.

If I quote the $129 package, it's because the $49 package doesn't suit our needs, don't take your customers for beginners.

[ZLTRGO]

3 minutes ago, Matt said:

Ticket support still exists! We simply ask that you post your issues in the staffed forum and then they will be either resolved, or triaged into tickets.

We are moving to a monthly release schedule to deliver bug fixes and features more regularly.

We are not holding you hostage, but if we were, I'd ask for two helicopters and pizza with pineapple on.

Then why can't we access the marketplace without an active license? Buy new apps without it? or no longer able to download them anymore directly?
This just feels like a hostage situation.

[Matt]

Just now, Duken said:

Ok clear, what are the new features of this year? Is there coming anything new before 2022? That can be a, yes i really need to renew the licence thing 🙂

Jordan posted about some new functionality coming in the next release. I also just added stock replies and I'm working through some achievement refinements. Those are in the pipeline over the next 3-4 weeks.

[Paul2020]

2 minutes ago, Matt said:

Appreciate the feedback and I'm sorry we weren't able to resolve your issue for you.

This is not the only reason not to renew the license. We have often written to you, but we have not received any responses at the time. Even the purchase of a residence was delayed for a long time.

You could at least offer old customers the opportunity to renew their license for a year at the old rates. You didn't do it. You would have received more money. But your marketing is not very good

[Matt]

1 minute ago, kims79 said:

If I quote the $129 package, it's because the $49 package doesn't suit our needs, don't take your customers for beginners.

It wasn't my intention, just reminding that our entry level package is $49 which may be suitable. It's hard for me to know without seeing your site and its needs. 🙂

[Dll]

39 minutes ago, abobader said:

The only thing I could not understand it very well, why you rise the price when you want to drop the email support?

Maths!

With a roughly 30% price increase, Invision are still better off even if 30% of their customers don't renew because they're also saving on support costs by offloading at least some of it onto the community. 

Edited September 15, 2021 by Dll

[WP V0RT3X]

2 minutes ago, Matt said:

Drop us a message and we can discuss it in more detail.

Why a PM? A simple yes or no would be nice. Also this could be interesting for other customers too.

[Matt]

5 minutes ago, ZLTRGO said:

Then why can't we access the marketplace without an active license? Buy new apps without it? or no longer able to download them anymore directly?
This just feels like a hostage situation.

The simple reason is that if you choose to not renew, then you cannot upgrade. If you do not upgrade then you are likely to be on an outdated version of Invision Community which may not be compatible with the latest releases of the third party applications.

Say you're on 4.3 and you go and buy an app written for 4.5, it likely won't work.

It's not a hostage situation, more of a sensible precaution. But I'm serious about the pizza.

4 minutes ago, Paul2020 said:

This is not the only reason not to renew the license. We have often written to you, but we have not received any responses at the time. Even the purchase of a residence was delayed for a long time.

You could at least offer old customers the opportunity to renew their license for a year at the old rates. You didn't do it. You would have received more money. But your marketing is not very good

I can look into your issues if you'd like?

4 minutes ago, Dll said:

Maths!

With a roughly 30% price increase, Invision are still better off even if 30% of their customers don't renew because they're also saving on support costs by offloading at least some of it onto the community. 

We're actually increasing support costs as we'll be hiring new people to ensure good coverage on the support forums. We are serious about wanting to create a comprehensive well staffed support community.

[Paul2020]

6 minutes ago, Matt said:

Appreciate the feedback and I'm sorry we weren't able to resolve your issue for you.

Well, how is it? Offer the old customers at the old prices to extend the license for 1 year. This will be a step. And what you are writing now is about nothing. Take a real step. And we will look at your attitude to customers. Everyone will see and appreciate it  🙂

[Matt]

2 minutes ago, Darth Vortex said:

Why a PM? A simple yes or no would be nice. Also this could be interesting for other customers too.

NSFW is NSFW.

I can't give you an answer without knowing more about the site, and I assumed you wouldn't want to discuss it publicly?

[Paul2020]

2 minutes ago, Matt said:

I can look into your issues if you'd like?

4 minutes ago, Dll said:

Yes, I do. But after you give all the old customers the opportunity to renew the license at the old prices

[Matt]

2 minutes ago, Paul2020 said:

Well, how is it? Offer the old customers at the old prices to extend the license for 1 year. This will be a step. And what you are writing now is about nothing. Take a real step. And we will look at your attitude to customers. Everyone will see and appreciate it  🙂

Some customers won't have renewals until well into 2022, we have to draw a line somewhere unfortunately.

[Daddy]

10 minutes ago, Matt said:

You could try our starter package, which is $49/month. You won't need to manage the internals, we do all that for you. It'll be one less thing to worry about so you can focus all your attention to growing and leading your community.

I don't get it. Those of us who are self hosted are self hosted for a reason. We don't need you to "manage the internals." We want to host in our own, secured environment, that we have 100% total control of. Not create an external point of failure subject to downtime and potential for compromises.

Sure, all of the shortcomings of cloud hosting could happen to self hosting, but I'd rather go out in my own terms. 😉

You're advertising to the wrong crowd. If we wanted cloud hosting, we wouldn't have chose IPS.

[Matt]

Just now, Deathicated said:

I don't get it. Those of us who are self hosted are self hosted for a reason. We don't need you to "manage the internals." We want to host in our own, secured environment, that we have 100% total control of. Not create an external point of failure subject to downtime and potential for compromises.

Sure, all of the shortcomings of cloud hosting could happen to self hosting, but I'd rather go out in my own terms. 😉

You're advertising to the wrong crowd. If we wanted cloud hosting, we wouldn't have chose IPS.

To whom do you speak for? Who is "we"?

[Paul2020]

1 minute ago, Matt said:

Some customers won't have renewals until well into 2022, we have to draw a line somewhere unfortunately

Don't be deceitful  🙂 I think for cool developers, you can solve this issue 🙂

[byMarcoX]

Pourquoi je vais payer 110$, alors que je n’ai jamais ouvert un ticket! Faites plutôt payer les tickets...
En plus il y a de moins en moins de choses, et moi les clubs, il me serve à rien.
De plus si en 2005/2006 je faisais 1.800.000 de pages vues par mois, aujourd’hui à cause des réseaux sociaux je dépasse à peine les 10.000.
J’ai de la chance d’avoir un forum de passionnés par le foot, car l’autre que j’avais sur ma ville, lui je suis passé de 1.800.000 par mois à moins de 1.000 pages vues par mois, donc je n’ai aucune raison de payer si cher, un service qui n’intéresse plus les internautes.
Du coup, ça me donne l’occasion de tout arrêter et passer à 100% sur les réseaux sociaux 100% gratuits.
Et je finirais par dire, heureusement, que Microsoft ne facture pas toutes ses mises à jour majeures ou de sécurités, voilà une entreprise qui pense différemment et à trouver des ressources ailleurs que de couper la tête à ses clients.
En 2005/2006 j’aurais accepté l’augmentation, en 2021, non !

Why am I going to pay $ 110, when I have never opened a ticket! Rather, charge the tickets ...
In addition there are less and less things, and me the clubs, it serves me for nothing.
In addition, if in 2005/2006 I had 1,800,000 page views per month, today because of social networks I barely exceed 10,000.
I'm lucky to have a forum of football enthusiasts, because the other one I had in my city, I went from 1,800,000 per month to less than 1,000 page views per month, so I have no reason to pay so much, a service that no longer interests Internet users.
Suddenly, it gives me the opportunity to stop everything and go 100% on social networks 100% free.
And I would end up saying, thankfully, that Microsoft doesn't charge for all of its major or security updates, this is a company that thinks differently and finds resources somewhere other than chopping off its customers.
In 2005/2006 I would have accepted the increase, in 2021, no!

[Daddy]

5 minutes ago, Matt said:

To whom do you speak for? Who is "we"?

The people who paid hundreds of dollars to be self hosted?

[Matt]

1 minute ago, byMarcoX said:

Pourquoi je vais payer 110$, alors que je n’ai jamais ouvert un ticket! Faites plutôt payer les tickets...
En plus il y a de moins en moins de choses, et moi les clubs, il me serve à rien.
De plus si en 2005/2006 je faisais 1.800.000 de pages vues par mois, aujourd’hui à cause des réseaux sociaux je dépasse à peine les 10.000.
J’ai de la chance d’avoir un forum de passionnés par le foot, car l’autre que j’avais sur ma ville, lui je suis passé de 1.800.000 par mois à moins de 1.000 pages vues par mois, donc je n’ai aucune raison de payer si cher, un service qui n’intéresse plus les internautes.
Du coup, ça me donne l’occasion de tout arrêter et passer à 100% sur les réseaux sociaux 100% gratuits.
Et je finirais par dire, heureusement, que Microsoft ne facture pas toutes ses mises à jour majeures ou de sécurités, voilà une entreprise qui pense différemment et à trouver des ressources ailleurs que de couper la tête à ses clients.
En 2005/2006 j’aurais accepté l’augmentation, en 2021, non !

Why am I going to pay $ 110, when I have never opened a ticket! Rather, charge the tickets ...
In addition there are less and less things, and me the clubs, it serves me for nothing.
In addition, if in 2005/2006 I had 1,800,000 page views per month, today because of social networks I barely exceed 10,000.
I'm lucky to have a forum of football enthusiasts, because the other one I had in my city, I went from 1,800,000 per month to less than 1,000 page views per month, so I have no reason to pay so much, a service that no longer interests Internet users.
Suddenly, it gives me the opportunity to stop everything and go 100% on social networks 100% free.
And I would end up saying, thankfully, that Microsoft doesn't charge for all of its major or security updates, this is a company that thinks differently and finds resources somewhere other than chopping off its customers.
In 2005/2006 I would have accepted the increase, in 2021, no!

The renewal cost also gets you updates (including major features) as well as support.

However, as you have rightly stated, there are free tools to build a community on too.

[Paul2020]

@Matt

I have been in development for more than 20 years. I remember the story of how Vbulletin died. I was only engaged in forums. One mistake can really cost you a crash. Now you have a choice: leave it as it is or offer a decent solution. As one of the options that I suggested to you.

Please answer in front of everyone - Are you ready to offer us my version? Give the opportunity to renew the license at the old prices for 1 year?

If not, why not?

[Daddy]

I know I've contributed well enough to this thread, so I'll end on this note. You're very clearly out of touch with your customer base. If you think we're just going to "get over it" while you're mocking us by advertising cloud hosting, you're mistaken.

You're going to lose the majority of clients that kept the marketplace alive, and following that the developers you've repeatedly hurt by your radical changes to the marketplace over the last several months.

I hope it was worth it.

</end rant>

[Matt]

8 minutes ago, Deathicated said:

The people who paid hundreds of dollars to be self hosted?

It's natural to assume that everyone thinks alike, but it's rarely the case.

The expectation is now that you buy a service, and not a product. Downloading zips, inflating zips, uploading files, setting up MySQL databases and so on will likely die with Gen x (of which I am, and likely my death is now wished to be expedited 😅)

5 minutes ago, Deathicated said:

I know I've contributed well enough to this thread, so I'll end on this note. You're very clearly out of touch with your customer base. If you think we're just going to "get over it" while you're mocking us by advertising cloud hosting, you're mistaken.

You're going to lose the majority of clients that kept the marketplace alive, and following that the developers you've repeatedly hurt by your radical changes to the marketplace over the last several months.

I hope it was worth it.

</end rant>

I understand your POV and I'm not mocking you or anyone else.

7 minutes ago, Paul2020 said:

@Matt

I have been in development for more than 20 years. I remember the story of how Vbulletin died. I was only engaged in forums. One mistake can really cost you a crash. Now you have a choice: leave it as it is or offer a decent solution. As one of the options that I suggested to you.

Please answer in front of everyone - Are you ready to offer us my version? Give the opportunity to renew the license at the old prices for 1 year?

If not, why not?

It's not usually wise to make knee-jerk promises. I've found this out the hard way.

[Paul2020]

3 minutes ago, Matt said:

It's not usually wise to make knee-jerk promises

Thank you 🙂 You have a great sense of humor. Drastic changes are something you can do, but at least consider this possibility... I didn't get a direct answer. I'm afraid that cold times are waiting for you.

[RevengeFNF]

I don't have any kind of monetization on my forum, so it survives with donations from my users.

I already told them that the price increased, and the overall reaction from them was: "It's possible to migrate to another forum software?"

Just to let you guys know that many people will have this kind of reaction, because we are talking about an increase of 60% just in the forums app.

I don't want to tell names, but your biggest competitor costs 55$ for the forum app, which is now a lot less than the 80$ from IPS.

[ahc]

@Matt  You may have removed the online user limit for cloud hosting, but I see that you replaced it with a limit on page impressions instead. Why are you guys determined to force people to limit their traffic or get charged up the arse with fees? You make it seem like you did everyone a favor, but all you did was slap some lipstick on the pig. 

Also, it’s $54/m. Let’s be real about the fact that a lot of those responding aren’t going to pay annually based on their feedback. 

[Matt]

1 minute ago, RevengeFNF said:

I don't have any kind of monetization on my forum, so it survives with donations from my users.

I already told them that the price increased, and the overall reaction from them was: "It's possible to migrate to another forum software?"

Just to let you guys know that many people will have this kind of reaction, because we are talking about an increase of 60% just in the forums app.

I don't want to tell names, but your biggest competitor costs 55$ for the forum app, which is now a lot less than the 80$ from IPS.

We never wanted to be the cheapest, just the best. 🙂