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To upgrade or not.

Guest theclub

By Guest theclub
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whitetigergrowl Enthusiast

whitetigergrowl

Posted
Posted

Having a forum is an interesting thing. Some people like staying with 'old reliable' while others upgrade with every release. Big or small.

However I sometimes wonder if some owners/root admins refuse to upgrade to significant releases only because of their personal preference and not necessarily what the members would like or prefer or custom skinning.

Forum software, like everything else, progresses with the wants and needs of the majority, not minority of the people. Some people think that if they wait, that the next version(s) will be better. How so? New features will be added, there will possibly be a new look, and existing features may get an overhaul. Some things might get improved, but then you might think other things are now shot down. Around and around we go.

Things like the new profile system are a natural progression of forum software. Up until this point most peoples profiles don't even get bothered to be looked at. They are lifeless, dull, and uninteractive. Seriously. What motivation is there to even visit someones profile if even the members don't want to fill it out or interact with it. At that point you might as well remove it all together. I have over 6,000 people on my site and the current profile system sucks. I would say easily well over half...maybe even 3/4ths of the people don't even fill theirs out. Let alone update it. Members have no motivation or reason to do it, let alone visit them. This is trying to breathe new life into an otherwise dead area. Sure you could hack it. Only to whine a few weeks later when the software gets upgraded and templates or coding gets changed as to make it useless. Even if its a security update.

Also, its a guaranteed fact that if ajax was full of holes, that neither VB or IPB would be using them. 2 of the largest and most secure forum software.

It doesn't matter what I want. It matters what my members want, even if I don't agree with it. And even I'm not 100% right. There have been things I added that I thought were stupid, useless, or not worth it. Yet ended up enjoying them. They are the reason I even have a site. So for those of you shooting down IPB 2.2, why not find out what your members think or want. Just because you might not like it or whatever, doesnt mean your members won't. So why rob them?

sure.. in about another year when the rest of the bugs get out of it and they design a layout that is closer to XP and one familiar to my family and friends. The same holds true to 2.2 as even the simplist things like making a post and trying to figure out how to make a word bold is changed. Rule one.. if it ain't broke, don't fix it! Add to it, sure (with the option to turn it off)... but LEAVE what was there!



When the rest of the bugs get out of it? HAHAHAHAHA! Windows XP has been around roughly 6 years....2-3x longer than any previous Windows....and bugs are STILL being found.

If it ain't broke don't fix it? Well what may not be broke to you may be broke to thousands of others. So in that case it needs to be fixed. If VB or IPB or PHPBB or anyone else didn't evolve and just stayed the same...I shiver at the thought of how many sites would be full of security holes because of all of the hacking people had to do to add features to their sites since nothing was changing. Would you want to take that risk with your board and members? Having the option to turn some of it off is fine. But all of it without it possibly adversely affecting other options and features?! Some of them ARE tied together. Shut one off and the rest have to go with it. Thus limiting functionality on your forum. And sometimes changing one little area means also changing numerous other areas in response. I mean, you want a working site right? Its give and take.

If you have been beta testing Vista (which has been RC1 since early Sept.) then you know there is a Windows XP look/mode. Much like XP has the older style Windows option/look.

Man, if all people did was wait, wait, wait for that almost perfect or better version of software.....we would all still be waiting with Windows 95 after having service patch 15. As for that 'old reliable'. Well, if you have done any hacking to your forum, you may have compromised it and just not realized it yet. An exploit could be there that you and others are not yet aware of. Until the site is gone that is. You could have your site up 5 years with no problems then wake up one morning with it gone. Its just a matter of time is all.
ScottyToledo Rookie

ScottyToledo

Posted
Posted

It doesn't matter what I want. It matters what my members want, even if I don't agree with it. And even I'm not 100% right. There have been things I added that I thought were stupid, useless, or not worth it. Yet ended up enjoying them. They are the reason I even have a site. So for those of you shooting down IPB 2.2, why not find out what your members think or want. Just because you might not like it or whatever, doesnt mean your members won't. So why rob them?



You hit the nail on the head right there for me. I've been running various forums and online communities for nearly 8 years now, and my members have ALWAYS come first. I fully intend to upgrade to 2.2. I like it, but even if I wasnt completely happy with it, I would still upgrade. (Unless it was REALLY awful.) I run a very good forum, and my members think of me as a friend, because that's exactly how I treat them. As friends. Not as a bunch of faceless people behind text on a screen. So I'm going to upgrade because I think they deserve the best forum experiance I can give them.
theclub Newbie

theclub

Posted
Posted

alot of the stuff like my Friends, ..... all this can be turned off ..

My Friends cannot be turned off.

However I sometimes wonder if some owners/root admins refuse to upgrade to significant releases only because of their personal preference and not necessarily what the members would like or prefer or custom skinning.

This is NOT a significant release, it's a point release, some of us will wait for 3.0 because it WILL be significant ... we also know our members, and what they want, you aren't the only one.


:)
Alex Veteran

Alex

Posted
Posted

When I first saw 2.2 I said there is no way I am upgrading. My decision still stands the same. I am really disappointed with this release and I'm still scratching my head whether buying a perptual license for IPB was the right choice rather than choosing to go with vBulletin. It seems many more professional sites are choosing to use vBulletin. But I will not go off into that.



First notice was how inconsistent the layout for IPB is getting. Everything looks so clunky and looks like things are just added here and there to make things work. For example the transition between each posts looks awful. The spacing is huge due to the new profile card thing. I like how vBulletin everything looks very consistent.



Next the RTE looks horrible. All the buttons are "different sizes" and look like they were designed by my 8 year old brother. When I toggle the sidepanel the thing looks all fudged up in Firefox. And whats with all the bevel and weird gradients on it? It just looks so messy and unprofessional. Those buttons don't even really match the default skin...



The new profile page.. don't even get me started. This is a forum software. I don't think so much focus should be made into making the next myspace in everyone's forum. I don't think the focus of a forum should be the user profile but the forum! Have people focus on the threads and posts and interact with each other in threads no in everyone's personal page.



I just don't see anything valuable in this release and it just looks inconsitent with what IPB has been doing in the past. It doens't look like some of the core issues peopel brought up were addressed looks like IPB just went off on a tangent off to who knows where. I really hope 3.0 will really make up for all this.. or I am going to be even more disappointed with my perpetual license...



Those were just things off the top of my head.. never realy took the time to sit down and put them into coherent arguments but i'm sure you'll get most of my stuff..



Many professional sites you say hmm? Take a look at the homepage of IPS, it says wellknown clients, Sony, NASA, too name a few are what I count as a professional company/site
XHio Newbie

XHio

Posted
Posted

I wont be upgrading, I for one am actually quite dissapointed with 2.2, it seems IPS have taken more time changing the ACP than anything else. People dont buy this type's of scripts to look at how nice the acp is. The profile pages may have undergone a major change, but apart from that its only really the RTE and submenu that looks any different from 2.1.7.

The profile pages are astonishing, they look good yes, but come on...IPB is suppose to be a forum software that companies could benifit from as well as individuals. They've made the whole Friends thing have a big part in 2.2, but why? To be honest, 2.2 is just looking like an alternative to Myspace, and sorry to sound rude, but IPS should pull their act together. Many mod makers would properbly be more than willing to make mods that will change IPB to have the whole friendship thing take a "precise" role.

[/rant]

Terry - AKA Dumbledore Experienced

Terry - AKA Dumbledore

Posted
Posted

I wont be upgrading, I for one am actually quite dissapointed with 2.2, it seems IPS have taken more time changing the ACP than anything else. People dont buy this type's of scripts to look at how nice the acp is. The profile pages may have undergone a major change, but apart from that its only really the RTE and submenu that looks any different from 2.1.7.



The profile pages are astonishing, they look good yes, but come on...IPB is suppose to be a forum software that companies could benifit from as well as individuals. They've made the whole Friends thing have a big part in 2.2, but why? To be honest, 2.2 is just looking like an alternative to Myspace, and sorry to sound rude, but IPS should pull their act together. Many mod makers would properbly be more than willing to make mods that will change IPB to have the whole friendship thing take a "precise" role.[/rant]





Maybe you haven't been reading the board. The major changes in the code are coming in the 3.0 version, which is still in development. This point version was done to address the security concerns and to phase in some of the new features from 3.0. Are these the only changes? No more will be here when 3.0 is ready.
Sinistra Sensei Experienced

Sinistra Sensei

Posted
Posted

Maybe you haven't been reading the board. The major changes in the code are coming in the 3.0 version, which is still in development. This point version was done to address the security concerns and to phase in some of the new features from 3.0. Are these the only changes? No more will be here when 3.0 is ready.


alot of people don't read updates apparently

all this was is a point release. meaning they fixed some security issues and added SOME new features
Watty Apprentice

Watty

Posted
Posted

I'll upgrade for several reasons, least of which is the fact that my board isn't active yet I love IPB, IPS, and the mgmt/staff - so by installing/upgrading I can provide feedback if I find exception to something.

From my past experience with the company, Matt and the rest of the coders take feedback very seriously. The company wouldn't be where it's at today if they ignored feedback. I remember when the "subscriptions" part of IPB came out. I thought (yes, I worked for IPS at the time of its release) to myself "what a waste". However, since I never actively used that particular function, I've all but forgotten it still exists. I suppose the same can be said with regard to the "Friends" thingy". Will I personally benefit from it? Probably not - however, I have a teenage step-son whose life (seemingly) revolves around MySpace.com. If IPB adds a few "neat" things to their core that attracts a younger audience, so be it - and good for them! I've showed my teen the new IPB and he thinks it's cool and all that... If he wants his own website in addition to his myspace stuff, then I'll purchase a domain name for him and rent him some space from IPS. :)

Bottom line... not everyone will LIKE new additions, but some will. New additions probably won't distract from the effectiveness of your board... and like many have said, I'm sure someone will provide a mod or two to disable certain functions. :)

Gotta move ahead - Idle feet causes cramps. :lol:

Madd069 Newbie

Madd069

Posted
Posted

I will probably upgrade to 2.2 around 2 months after the Final is released. That way, many security problems will be fixed, there will be many mods and skins made and ported over, and it might be a few bucks cheaper.

theclub Newbie

theclub

Posted
Posted

I will probably upgrade to 2.2 around 2 months after the Final is released. That way, many security problems will be fixed, there will be many mods and skins made and ported over, and it might be a few bucks cheaper.


Let's hope all the mods are updated for you, although, with the way some modders are never seen again, l wouldn't hold your breath.

:rolleyes:
  • 3 weeks later...
mgalyen Newbie

mgalyen

Posted
Posted

well I just read where one member here reminded he is upgrading because of his members will like it, not necessarily his own opinion. hehe... I had to chuckle on that. I opened up the beta forum to all of my members. True, I only have about 1700 in that one site... not ONE of them gave a positive response. Not one.

My previous post was taken with that data into consideration.

Like I said... if it ain't broke, don't fix it... and if one ADDS to a program, that is a good thing... members can use the same old comfortable and well detailed way they are used to and explore the new options if they choose to. But when a drastic change like taking the post box and changing the easy to follow text to a bunch of icons that no one recognizes, then even removing some and adding others in it, not one member commented positive on that. (even those whom belong to VB style forums...) As to the profile situation... I have less than 2% whom even use it. If they want to tout out to who and what they are, they can use myspace... They don't come to the forums to do this. Even then, who knows what is actually real in profile... it easy nuff to pretend something else in there... and adding more to it just allows those few who try to take advantage in it, to peverse it even more. Fact is... I turned off a lot of the profile inputs for when member registers even.
As to ajax not having security holes in it.. now that I find funny. Just do a google search on how to hack ajax and after the millions of hits you get, one might begin to suspect the realism there. And upgrading just because of security is one thing... but if that security means where one has to completely attempt to retrain all the admin, try to walk present and new members through the mess of changed directives, well the board might as well be hacked by IPB instead of a real hacker.

maybe by version 3, IPB will realize the loss of revenue and do like many companies with a 'project turnaround' and go back to what works and offer means to turn options on and off within the aCP

Mesmer Collaborator

Mesmer

Posted
Posted

I will upgrade but only because of a few things:
- improved captcha in registration
- captcha for guest posting
- improved security
- multiple poll options
- I want my board to be up-to-date so I'm sure it has the latest against spammers / hackers

for the rest I really don't care

lrusso Newbie

lrusso

Posted
Posted

Why wouldn't I upgrade, they paid a good pile of green backs to have security firm ( no idea which firm, but lets face it, even the worst security firm would have a leg up on security ), that fact alone is worth the upgrade. Infact I would be honest, if they would release lets say 2.1.8 and it contained the new security features, I would use that but not because I don't like the features of 2.2.x but because its been well tested.



I assume they paid with money, who knows what kind of deal they had :devil:


http://www.gulftech.org/

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