Feature Creep on IPB 3.x?

[Charles]

We have seriously considered posting roadmaps in the past but posting that just brings on frustration from people who don't understand that a roadmap is a guide not a hard-fast rule on what is to come and will go ballistic if something is missed on the roadmap.

In general what we post on the blogs and the announcement forums is what we intend to do or have done. Those posts in the forums are the staff thinking out loud so to speak. We don't reply to every single topic as sometimes you will lose your mind if you try to chase down every single post :)

[Fast Lane!]

We have seriously considered posting roadmaps in the past but posting that just brings on frustration from people who don't understand that a roadmap is a guide not a hard-fast rule on what is to come and will go ballistic if something is missed on the roadmap.

In general what we post on the blogs and the announcement forums is what we intend to do or have done. Those posts in the forums are the staff thinking out loud so to speak. We don't reply to every single topic as sometimes you will lose your mind if you try to chase down every single post :)

Agree that people sometimes focus to much on the roadmaps, but I would suggest that "gross" features that impact people should go on a roadmap. Those items that impact for example large architectural changes (hence many mods). New features that are "add ons" that you want to keep away from the competition I would agree should be left off until they are announced. Once they are announced though (cleancut is an example) then they should go on a roadmap to help people plan accordingly for their introduction and how they can do things ahead of time. A roadmap does set expectations but I would argue that tfor any enterprise or business software that this is critical. I do believe that IPB has marketed itself in this direction (and I use it on several large sites as part of a business) so I think that it is appropriate in this case. To me, money is not an issue in the sense that I would pay "extra" to have a stable and predictable upgrade path versus uncertainty and unpredictability when designing other things to accommodate a core technology (like IPB).

[Charles]

Well we sort of do that via our Blog entries. Our dev updates let you know what is coming in the next versions so you can plan accordingly. We have also pointed out core changes that are not features but do change how those that write mods/hooks interact with the system.

[Charles]

Here is the complete list of IP.Board 3.1 dev updates if you're curious:

[url= Sharing
Easily share links from your community to Facebook, Twitter, and more. Great way to drive traffic to your community!

[url= Updates
Enhancements to the existing member status system in IP.Board to include the ability to reply and more.

[url= Preview
Preview the first few lines of a topic without loading the entire topic.

[url= Reputation
Optionally allow your members to see who gave reputation points on their posts.

[url= Integration
Your members can now link their account with their Twitter account!

[url= Facebook Integration
Further enhance the link between your community and Facebook to drive traffic.

Advertising Code Integration: [url= 1 and [url= 2
Easily place advertising code throughout your community with simple settings in the admin area.

Profile Customizations: [url= 1 and [url= 2
Allow your members to customize the look and feel of their profile page.

[url= Upgrader
Upgrading your skin between versions of IP.Board just became a lot easier.

[url= Delete Posts and Topics
Rather than actually deleting a post or topic you can now hide it from view to easily restore it later.

[url= System
An easier way to be notified of all the various events that happen in your community.

[url= Development Enhancements
Great tools for those that create modifications for IP.Board

[url= System Improvements
Improvements to the IP.Board hook system to make it easier for modification developers to expand the functions in the software.

Search Engine Optimization: [url= 1 and [url= 2
Allow search engines to better index and rank your community in results.

[Fast Lane!]

people who don't understand that a roadmap is a guide not a hard-fast rule on what is to come and will go ballistic if something is missed on the roadmap.)

I also would suggest that as a company you now have two user groups. One more vocal than the other:

1) Fan sites and small social forums. These sites love mods and do not mind instability as a trade with having the "newest" and "coolest" design and tech. They are often the first to ask for new features and also are the most vocal when they are missed. They do not mind drastic changes with no "middle step".

2) Businesses. These people are often less concerned with the newest features but instead stability. They want to understand changes ahead of time and plan for them as to make transitions as smoothly as possible for their clients. They are often the least vocal. They want to make changes in smaller steps and not big leaps (as big jumps may confuse their clients who often look at the forums as a "tool" versus "a cool factor").

I fall into the latter and have hence put off IPB 3.x. Cleancut or a reduced (less drastic changing skin) was the option I was waiting for. I needed a middle ground to jump to that was fully supported and more gracefully transitioned from the older 2.x platform.

[Charles]

Oh we know that there is a silent majority :) Very few of our clients actually post on our company forums here. It's sometimes difficult for those that do to understand why we might think feature X is not as important as feature Y because they don't see the feedback we get from our corporate customers.

[Nervosa]

Extra or Unneeded features -
As long as it doesn't impact performance and I can turn them off if I don't like, who cares. Little things here and there are what will set IPB out from the rest even if it is something simple as user profile backgrounds.
Hell maybe 3.2 will have an addon that makes coffee and cookies!

[Wolfie]

We have seriously considered posting roadmaps in the past but posting that just brings on frustration from people who don't understand that a roadmap is a guide not a hard-fast rule on what is to come and will go ballistic if something is missed on the roadmap.

I know how some people can't seem to tell the difference from considering something and promising it. However, what about something where there would be a few lists.
* Items being considered for the version being roadmapped. At this point, even if IPS knows for a fact that a specific feature will be added, it would remain here until it's actually being worked on. EVERYTHING at this point is only consideration and subject to being rejected completely or delayed to another version. It should be made painfully clear that the 'consideration' list are not guaranteed to be in the release and are likely to getting rejected.
* Items that are in progress/being worked on and therefore WILL be in the release
* Items completed but not fully tested (alpha testing to debug)
* Items completed and tested (ready for beta)

If we know what definitely WON'T be in a release, that helps. If we know what is up for consideration, then we (as members) can give feedback on which ideas on the list we like or dislike, so that if something gets axed, then the level of popularity can be considered.

Hell maybe 3.2 will have an addon that makes coffee and cookies!

I'm not a coffee drinker, how about milk instead? Oh and the cookies should be either chocolate chip, sugar or the oreo style (double stuff rocks!)

[rbiss]

Don't underestimate the level of corporate involvement and experience some customers have here. I can assure you there are things everyone can learn from each other, no matter which side of the board they are posting from.

[Wolfie]

Don't underestimate the level of corporate involvement and experience some customers have here. I can assure you there are things everyone can learn from each other, no matter which side of the board they are posting from.

"Don't underestimate the power of the dark side..."

/offtopic

[.Ian]

It seems this topic is mostly about CleanCut (which we have renamed from beta to final since it really is quite stable and supported).

Great news - thank you

[pkiula]

Is there any theme that is simple and minimalistic? There's way too much going on in this theme. And the blue folder stuff is just ugly. I quite like the look and feel of "Vanillaforums.org" forum-- it is clean and one know what one has to do. With IPB, unless one is very familiar with the whole forum stuff, it's highly confusing.

Perhaps there is a simple theme. I do like IPB's features, so I do want to use this forum, but absolutely adore a simpler theme. Not everyone wants the full shebang in the forum.

Thanks!

[.Ian]

Which skin are you talking about?

If you mean IP.Board, then yes that is the default. Cleancut is a much better skin (INMHO), but sadly that is once again not available, so you cannot currently view it.

There is also a skin generator available (see the blogs) which allows you to alter colours very easily, but sadly not for cleancut :(

It is also worth mentioning that is it is very easy to remove features from the forums display :)

As far as other skins are concerned, you are welcome to install and run any one of hundreds of different skins and colour schemes - you do not even need to have the default skin available to your members :)

[pkiula]

Well there's no trial so I cannot really test it out, can I?

[.Ian]

Trial of what?

If you are refering to the third party skin, you need to contact the author for a trial.

If you are talking about IPB, then yes you can have a trial (I believe it is a a week) - just click here for more info

[pkiula]

Trial of what?

If you are refering to the third party skin, you need to contact the author for a trial.

If you are talking about IPB, then yes you can have a trial (I believe it is a a week) - just click here for more info

The IPB demo is 48 hours, that is 2 days. And completely useless because I cannot try it on our servers with importing, upgrading, etc.

[.Ian]

I am fairly sure it is a week now, a quick email to sales@invisionpower.com will extend it anyway.

Or another alternative is just to have a hosted solution for $9.99 for a month, that includes the licence and you can mess around with it for a longer period. click here for details.

[Wolfie]

I am fairly sure it is a week now, a quick email to sales@invisionpower.com will extend it anyway.

From the demo page:

Product Demo

Blog posting about the increase from 24 to 48 hours:
[url=" System Term Extended

19 February 2010

Posted by Charles

While not a particular interesting blog entry :) I wanted anyone interested to know that our demo service term has been extended from 24 to 48 hours. As always, you can email sales for a further extension if you might need more time.

If you are considering using IP.Board now is a great time to get your proverbial feet wet on version 3.0.5 so you are ready as soon as the upcoming version 3.1 is released! If you have any questions, feel free to email sales@invisionpower.com to speak to our sales staff or post in our pre-sales forum for friendly help from the community.

[.Ian]

thanks for that - not! :P

[Wolfie]

thanks for that - not! :P

Just helping to keep you informed. :P

I think it used to be a week, a few years back. But you were right about IPS usually willing to extend it if asked.

[Invisiοnist]

Wow, I am ashamed I missed this very important topic. I have to say alot of things mentioned here really does make sense. I was shocked to see the reports that the OP had made in the first page there. IPS did lead users to believe it will be alot bigger than just a regular skin and will be heavily supported. From the sounds of it, that didn't happen. I don't even see the skin selectable on the current board which is a shame because I would have liked a live preview of this skin.

As for the way the company is headed...

Haha.

How can you complain? IPS has become so amazing. I really can not say anything negative from my experience with them so far. Though I admit I haven't been here long so perhaps I'm just not exposed to enough yet, but I still believe this is just an amazing company and my only regret is not being here from the start.

The features that IPS has been releasing are just the icing on the cake. It's something that sets this company apart from the competitors. vB, phpBB, etc all have nice stuff.. but it's not support. Here on IPS all the "little things" that make the boards really enjoyable are fully supported and up to date with each release. No worries about things not working out or someone not upgraded the features anymore. This is a common case with vB.

If I had to find something that was slightly unpleasing about IPS it would be the skins. Not for the appearance, because I find all their skins very pleasing to the eye-- but the ability for them to actually work with everything. Many skins that are not already supported by IPS (which is just CleanCut and IP.Board Default)don't work with everything. I find it very hard to have a skin from the customer resources area that actually works with IP.Blog, IP.Tracker, IP.Board, IP.Gallery, etc. There is usually something that doesn't work. And in alot of cases I have to duplicate the images folder into the skins folder for it to work. My question is why isn't it already there? Why aren't things already packaged with the skins so it works in first install instead of manually adding things... I just find that to be a headache.

[Wolfie]

I don't even see the skin selectable on the current board which is a shame because I would have liked a live preview of this skin.

They've removed it until it can be updated for v3.1

[Invisiοnist]

At least it is being worked on then :)

[Mat Barrie]

Many skins that are not already supported by IPS (which is just CleanCut and IP.Board Default)don't work with everything. I find it very hard to have a skin from the customer resources area that actually works with IP.Blog, IP.Tracker, IP.Board, IP.Gallery, etc. There is usually something that doesn't work. And in alot of cases I have to duplicate the images folder into the skins folder for it to work. My question is why isn't it already there? Why aren't things already packaged with the skins so it works in first install instead of manually adding things... I just find that to be a headache.

I think you'll find that you won't have that problem with paid skins. Not because the free skins are poor quality or anything, but simply because they are doing it as a hobby and do not want to invest their own money into purchasing the addons to support them, while the commercial skinners consider buying all the IPS add-ons "a cost of doing business". You want more quality free skins that support all apps, I recommend dropping a few dollars every now and again to the free skinners. Because I assure you, people don't donate. I have "donate" links on every single (free) product download page I have, and yet I have not seen a single cent in donations. Ever.

[Mark]

Just helping to keep you informed. :P

I think it used to be a week, a few years back. But you were right about IPS usually willing to extend it if asked.

If one contacts sales, it's as long as needed ;)