IPB3 admin language

[boon79]

Hi,

In version 2, the administration could not have been translated. In version 3, it is still not possible entirely. The phrases of the left column menu are stored in separate files.

Can we (international users) expect a fully tranlatable administration interface in the near future?

Thanks

[IPBSupport.de]

+1!!!

And, same as help & board guidelines.

All this must be translatable for international boards (with more than one language)...

Example:

User A speak only french...
User B speak only german...
User C speak only english...

Now, we have the help-files and board guidelines only in french on a french board - and user B / user C cant read the help-files and board guidelines because they cant speak/read french...

That could also be a legal problem. And its soooooo easy to make all multi-language-translatable. :)

[bfarber]

The phrases in the left column are stored under Manage Applications & Modules in the System tab. You will need to edit each module if you wish to change it's language string.

[RedEnzian]

yes we can (hm .. is there a copyright on that line? :) ) but then the ACP is not fully translateable and Boards with an international Administrator or Moderator crew have a problem since the phrases are still only available in one language.

Also (Rigo already said it) the Board Guidelines, the Registration Benefits, the Boardguidelinesheaderstring, the Helpfiles and the Login Information text should be translateable to suite the requirements of an international board.

[bfarber]

Unfortunately, some data is stored in the database, and we do not make this translatable in most cases. The same goes for posts you submit (and data like it, such as the topic title). You cannot translate this data to each language.

[boon79]

[quote name='bfarber' date='18 May 2009 - 04:11 PM' timestamp='1242659479' post='1803091']
Unfortunately, some data is stored in the database, and we do not make this translatable in most cases. The same goes for posts you submit (and data like it, such as the topic title). You cannot translate this data to each language.


I use some other forum softwares as well, and they are translatable fully. Anyway, are planning to change this? 'cause, right now it seems a bit of a half job.

[IPBSupport.de]

[quote name='bfarber' date='18 May 2009 - 04:41 PM' timestamp='1242657709' post='1803063']The phrases in the left column are stored under Manage Applications & Modules in the System tab. You will need to edit each module if you wish to change it's language string.
Sorry brandon, but this must be a bad joke... That is anything else but not professional, and you know it...

When international sites release a languagepack (german, french or other) we cant say the people "You must edit (translate) that, that and that yourself/allone". <_<

IPS know that the ACP should be translatable (or not all coders? :ph34r: ). Why then not also the ACP menu (ACP menu = part of the ACP)?

Completely confused,
Helge


Edit:

[quote name='bfarber' date='18 May 2009 - 05:11 PM' timestamp='1242659479' post='1803091']Unfortunately, some data is stored in the database, and we do not make this translatable in most cases.
Sorry when i must say that, but its not a problem to make a simple query (in ACP) for board guidelines (etc) and put on the edit-page more than one text field (for every language one) with the guidelines for every language (or TABs).

[quote name='bfarber' date='18 May 2009 - 05:11 PM' timestamp='1242659479' post='1803091']The same goes for posts you submit (and data like it, such as the topic title). You cannot translate this data to each language.
Thats not the same. ;) Board guidelines = for ALL users - a language specific categorie/forum in the board = only for that people who can speak the language...

[WinFuture]

I fully agree with Rigo. A half-translated ACP would be very annoying. I always thought that IPB3 would become a proper piece of software, because things like a complete ACP translation were promised several times. I mixture of languages will not be able to convince me of your coding skills.

[boon79]

[quote name='WinFuture' date='18 May 2009 - 05:06 PM' timestamp='1242662766' post='1803108']
I mixture of languages will not be able to convince me of your coding skills.


I'm sure it's nothing to do with their coding skills. IPB3 is awesome, they did a pretty good job, but for international users the admin area will be in two languages. That's just makes this software look unprofessional, and I guess international users who's been waiting for the admin area to be translatable for a long time, not to mention that they were led to believe that this time it WOULD be translatable, may see this as a spit in their faces.

[Luke]

I know that many areas of the board pull the language bits from the language pack system directly, but for cases of menu's generated by tables, etc... what about an on-the-fly alternative? Like {lang:my_lang_bit}. That way anything that pulls in dynamically can be abstracted. You wouldn't even have to use a regular expression to accomplish this. You could do something like:



(code above is a working example. replace 'LANG['.$key.']' with the language bit using $key)

while(($pos = strpos($html, '{lang:', isset($pos) ? $pos+6 : 0)) !== false) {

	if(($endb = strpos($html, '}', $pos)) !== false) {

		$key = substr($html, $pos+6, $endb-$pos-6);

		$html = substr_replace($html, 'LANG['.$key.']', $pos, $endb-$pos+1);

	} else break;

}

[bfarber]

Menus are something we can do. It's even easier than you suggest Luke - we can look for a language key *if it exists* (like we do in some other areas already) and if not just use what is in the database (lang key based on app_module or something like that).

The problem is, this isn't going to please everyone. Someone else already mentioned forum rules and board rules and so forth - it's just not easily feasible to handle EVERY text that is stored in the database in every language available. The ACP is language abstracted now, just as the front end is. The text that is displayed is now in a language file, where it's not stored in the database. This is the same as the front end. Over time we can work to tweak additional areas that are easy to implement, such as the menus.

[boon79]

This is how it looks if you translate the forum:



One half is in one language, the other half is in a different one. It's ridicoulus, it's confusing and it's useless. I'm translating the forum because many people are expecting it. What can I do now? If I translate all the language strings on half of the admin area will remain in english. Or should I just leave the admin area and not translate it. Then we are at v2 again.
I can't believe you left this part out.

[Michael]

They didn't "leave anything out", they explained what the issue is: some of the text there comes from the components, not language strings. The language abstraction in the Admin CP is exponentially better than it was in the 2.x series, I think people should be getting off IPS's back about this. If you simply state what the issues are, they can look into fixing them for future releases, but you guys chose to toss out words like "ridiculous", "useless" & "not professional". As a developer myself, I can tell you that's about the worst way to try and get support for your issues.

I agree that I think it would be something that would be good to look into for the future, but seriously guys, you make it sound like this is the worst thing in the world, when clearly it is not.

[WinFuture]

@bfarber

If you really need these texts in the database, just save optional translations in the language files. This is not the most efficient way, but the easiest for the translators.

[boon79]

[quote name='Μichael' date='18 May 2009 - 06:48 PM' timestamp='1242668919' post='1803153']
but seriously guys, you make it sound like this is the worst thing in the world, when clearly it is not.


Then put yourself in the shoes of someone who can't or barely speak english. I'm sure this is one of the reasons why many, many potential users didn't choose IPB during the v2 era.

[IPBSupport.de]

[quote name='Μichael' date='18 May 2009 - 07:48 PM' timestamp='1242668919' post='1803153']They didn't "leave anything out", they explained what the issue is: some of the text there comes from the components, not language strings.
Yes, from the IPS components (in this moment). And the components could also save the texts to language file(s) :thumbsup:

[quote name='Μichael' date='18 May 2009 - 07:48 PM' timestamp='1242668919' post='1803153']The language abstraction in the Admin CP is exponentially better than it was in the 2.x series, I think people should be getting off IPS's back about this.
Yes, better, but not perfect. I dont know why IPS not make it directly perfect and say only "We can make it in the future". IPS does a lot of unnecessary, redundant work...

[quote name='Μichael' date='18 May 2009 - 07:48 PM' timestamp='1242668919' post='1803153']As a developer myself, I can tell you that's about the worst way to try and get support for your issues.
Support? Our issues? Its feedback for IPS (software) issues ;) I know, for IPS / the english IPS customers its OK as it is now, but not for international customers... And it has been like this for years...

[quote name='Μichael' date='18 May 2009 - 07:48 PM' timestamp='1242668919' post='1803153']...but seriously guys, you make it sound like this is the worst thing in the world, when clearly it is not.
We only want to make IP.Board perfect (for international customers)... :wub:

[bfarber]

You can already translate the text on your own site, as stated before (just edit the applications/modules from the Manage Applications page). This is only an issue if you need MULTI-language setups, and very few users do.

I've already stated this particular issue I can look into later. There's an intermediate solution already for your own boards. I'm not sure what more you expect right now I'm afraid. We're doing the best we can. Just language abstracting the ACP for 3.x took me *weeks* as it is. We are at a point now where we cannot spend a ton of time making things that are stored in the database language abstractable but I will look into it in the next release.

[WinFuture]

[quote name='bfarber' date='18 May 2009 - 09:21 PM' timestamp='1242674483' post='1803204']
You can already translate the text on your own site, as stated before (just edit the applications/modules from the Manage Applications page).


So, translators cannot offer a complete languagepack. They have to create an additional sql-file or something like this. Or they just won't translate the ACP as they do not want to change things in the databases.

[quote name='bfarber' date='18 May 2009 - 09:21 PM' timestamp='1242674483' post='1803204']
We are at a point now where we cannot spend a ton of time making things that are stored in the database language abstractable but I will look into it in the next release.


Next release is IPB3. Nobody forces you to release IPB3 as soon as possible but as complete and flexible as possible. Just take your time.

[bfarber]

*sigh*

I'm afraid we aren't going to be able to hold up IPB3 for language abstracted menus. IF we get all the bugs done and there is time, I MAY be able to look into it before final is released. But best I can offer is to check for the next version. If we get to it before then great. If not, next version.

I'm afraid I can't offer you anything better right now. There are too many more important bugs that we have to address.

[RedEnzian]

Hello again,

ive started to write a Plugin so that international Boardadministrators who needs to translate the Terms, Logininfo, Reginfo and Boardguidelines into every installed language.

read more on http://forums.invisionpower.com/index.php?app=blog&module=display&section=blog&blogid=442&

its not finished, but i hope i have a testversion available soon and i hope also to add more things to translate into it in the future.

[tamplan]

[quote name='WinFuture' date='18 May 2009 - 09:19 PM' timestamp='1242677959' post='1803229']
So, translators cannot offer a complete languagepack. They have to create an additional sql-file or something like this. Or they just won't translate the ACP as they do not want to change things in the databases.



Next release is IPB3. Nobody forces you to release IPB3 as soon as possible but as complete and flexible as possible. Just take your time.

I totally agree with what has been written.
Take the example of the 'Online/offline' message. This setting key is 'offline_msg'. There is no reason to change this message very often.
So, we can use it with a language file like:

Everything that depends on the user's language should be in language files.

There is no need for another system that already used to translate the input language in the ACP.

Hope this help :)

$this->lang->words['offline_msg']

It is almost the same principle for the management of the dates with a little function to translate days and months :

$lang = array(

'ipb_calendar_mon' => "1",

'month_january' => $this->lang->words['M_1'],

'day_monday' => $this->lang->words['D_1'],

...

To translate days and months depending on the user's language choice:

function translate_date($my_timestamp, $type='long')

{

$my_date = strftime($this->lang->words['clock_'.$type], $my_timestamp);

$day = strftime('%A', $my_timestamp);

$key_day = strtolower($day);

$translated_date = str_replace($day, $this->lang->words['day_'.$key_day], $my_date);


$month = strftime('%B', $my_timestamp);

$key_month = strtolower($month);

$translated_date = str_replace($month, $this->lang->words['month_'.$key_month], $translated_date);

return $translated_date;

}