Why IPS Has the better deal

[Collin1000]

Was just checking out vB today....
$150 for Installation. IPS does it free.

The new licensing for 4.0 does not even come with ticket support! Thats another $80 a year.

IPS installs forums for free (I never knew this was a free service until earlier today!) and gives support included with the license purchase.

IPS has customer service nailed.... if only they could hire 2 or 3 more people to take care of the new customers and surge of support needs. :whistle:

[AndyF]

Thanks for your feedback :)

Just to add as you mentioned installation (as I do not know how this works elsewhere) an IPS technician will upgrade your board for you too (example: you are still running 2.3.6 and want 3.0.5) if you request it.

[Joe D]

I like the support here, This is perfect for the beginner like I am. When I get over my head, I put in a support ticket. It is also a learning experience.

I am also glad I went with ip over V-bull :)

[Carl M]

30 days phone support included with an IPB license purchase too.

[Wolfie]

Was just checking out vB today....

$150 for Installation. IPS does it free.

The new licensing for 4.0 does not even come with ticket support! Thats another $80 a year.

IPS installs forums for free (I never knew this was a free service until earlier today!) and gives support included with the license purchase.

You mentioned the free install twice. :lol:

IPS, you purchase a license and you can use your board forever even if you never renew your license. vB you have to keep renewing or you are required to stop using the software.

IPS, you can renew your license at anytime and download the latest version of IPB, even if it's a new major version. Renewal is $25 for 6 months (for current license owners) and as said, can be renewed at any time. So you can let your license expire and then renew a year later and only pay $25. From what I understand, with vB, when a new major version is released, you have to pay to get an upgraded license (or buy a new license or whatever). Also if you let your license lapse, you have to stop using the software.

IPS, a license agreement is a license agreement. I own a lifetime license and for as long as IPB is produced and supported, I will always be able to get the latest version and get support for it. Has vB ever offered a lifetime license? If so, do they still honor it? Same with the Perpetual license - owners of those licenses will always be able to download the latest version of IPB and use it.

IPS, one of the founders is Matt who, as far as I've noticed, was the first (or one of the very first) to include the concept of unlimited forums within forums. This is going back to the days of ikonboard, which was a very very long time ago. Thus, IPB was one of the first boards to support it. Many other boards have since adopted the concept. IPS has introduced other features and concepts which have since been adopted by others.

IPS tries its best to use clean PHP coding. I recall someone describing vB code one time and they mentioned that it's very disorganized/cluttered/messy.

IPS has been growing over the years. vB recently got bought by another company and implemented changes that upset a great many of its clients.

IPS, includes new features and improved code with new major releases (and small improvements/features with minor releases). vB (from what I remember) has bug-fixed one version and boxed it up as a new major version, requiring people to buy a new license for essentially the same product.


There's actually more but I think the point is made.

[Mark]

I love working with new converts:
"Yeah sure, let's do an upgrade, how much will that cost?"
"There's no charge, sir"
"What? Really? You'll do it for free!?"

Every time :P

[Jaggi]

I love working with new converts:

"Yeah sure, let's do an upgrade, how much will that cost?"

"There's no charge, sir"

"What? Really? You'll do it for free!?"

Every time :P

i might ask for one just to see if you'll call me sir :P.

[Glumbo]

I'm glad I chose IPB over VB4 as well.

[Tanax]

IPS, one of the founders is Matt who, as far as I've noticed, was the first (or one of the very first) to include the concept of unlimited forums within forums. This is going back to the days of ikonboard, which was a very very long time ago. Thus, IPB was one of the first boards to support it. Many other boards have since adopted the concept. IPS has introduced other features and concepts which have since been adopted by others.

That's not entirely fair. Other forum softwares have come up with tons of stuff that IPB have implemented after the others.
Just take the newly addition with the Reputation system. That has been a standard feature on vB for a very long time.

Don't get me wrong though, I'm beginning to love IPB more and more and I'm thinking about purchasing.
vB is not what it used to be, and IPB is definitely more appealing.

IPS tries its best to use clean PHP coding. I recall someone describing vB code one time and they mentioned that it's very disorganized/cluttered/messy.

This is a personal opinion though. If you view any vB fanboy coder they will tell you the exact opposit. It all comes down to what you prefer and what style of coding that suits you best to work with. It is also something that you get used to so if you work with coding scripts for IPB you're getting used to their system so if you then try to code a script for vB you would probably think it's quite difficult to navigate and using the correct classes etc and where everything's located.

[Mark]

This is a personal opinion though. If you view any vB fanboy coder they will tell you the exact opposit. It all comes down to what you prefer and what style of coding that suits you best to work with. It is also something that you get used to so if you work with coding scripts for IPB you're getting used to their system so if you then try to code a script for vB you would probably think it's quite difficult to navigate and using the correct classes etc and where everything's located.

Indeed: IP.Board is object-oriented, vBulletin is procedural. Both programming styles have their merits and different people have their preferences :)

I don't know if vBulletin also has this, but while we're on the subject of coding practises - this may be of interest.

[Wolfie]

That's not entirely fair. Other forum softwares have come up with tons of stuff that IPB have implemented after the others.

Just take the newly addition with the Reputation system. That has been a standard feature on vB for a very long time.

Things like a reputation system borders on bloating. Don't get me wrong, I know that IPS has implemented features after other boards have added them. But I recall a few years back how IPS had come up with something new and then suddenly vB was announcing that they had come up with the idea (ie, they were the original). I can't recall what it was but that was more of the point I was thinking about. To my knowledge, IPS hasn't said that they came up with the original idea of a reputation system. I didn't quite explain it right in my previous post, so that's on me.

This is a personal opinion though. If you view any vB fanboy coder they will tell you the exact opposit. It all comes down to what you prefer and what style of coding that suits you best to work with. It is also something that you get used to so if you work with coding scripts for IPB you're getting used to their system so if you then try to code a script for vB you would probably think it's quite difficult to navigate and using the correct classes etc and where everything's located.

I can't speak from personal knowledge (I haven't looked at vB code because I don't have it), but I got the impression that when the code was looked it, it was rather frightening. Not like, "OMG this is way above my head", but more along the lines of Nanny 9-1-1 going into a house and then a moment later coming out announcing an early retirement. "Complete pandamonium" comes to mind. I wish I could remember who and where, because then I could have a better idea on what they meant and such.

I have seen horrible coding before (aside from my own puny attempts). Go look at the code of LotGD. Unless they've cleaned it up, it's a disaster waiting to happen.

[bfarber]

Let's be sure this topic doesn't start to "bash" any competitors. :) I'm not pointing fingers or saying the topic is doing just that, but a friendly reminder.

As Mark said, different people have different opinions. IPB largely uses OOP style coding practices. vb uses procedural for the most part. Different people have different preferences about which coding style is better, and it's nothing more than a preference usually.

Additionally, IPB has features in it that others have "come up with" first, and vice-versa. It's the nature of software development when there is competition in the market. A user might like IPB better, but like some feature in a competing product, and come to us asking us to add it. If there's enough support we will. I don't consider this copying (even when competitors do it) - it's simply meeting the demands of your clientele.

[jguy]

As for someone who has used both IPB/IPS and vB in an administrator standpoint since both were in version 1, I'd have to say that IPS has always taken the cake in regards to features, support and pricing.

for a while there, right around 2.0 -> 2.1, I liked vB more as they hadn't changed the look of their administrator panel and I had issues moving around in the new admin panels of IPB ;p.

As far as coding and source is concerned, I do like IPS's coding formats and styles, but as mentioned, it's all about personal preference.

[iAdi]

IPS is the best!
The Best support, the best products and the best service.

[Wolfie]

Let's be sure this topic doesn't start to "bash" any competitors. :) I'm not pointing fingers or saying the topic is doing just that, but a friendly reminder.

As Mark said, different people have different opinions. IPB largely uses OOP style coding practices. vb uses procedural for the most part. Different people have different preferences about which coding style is better, and it's nothing more than a preference usually.

Additionally, IPB has features in it that others have "come up with" first, and vice-versa. It's the nature of software development when there is competition in the market. A user might like IPB better, but like some feature in a competing product, and come to us asking us to add it. If there's enough support we will. I don't consider this copying (even when competitors do it) - it's simply meeting the demands of your clientele.

As I had mentioned, I haven't seen the PHP code for vB, I'm only telling what I remember hearing (reading) from someone else on their opinion of it. My personal opinion of the coding is that I'm not able to give one because I haven't seen it for myself. Even if I were to see it and compare it against IPB's coding, I wouldn't be able to give an opinion based on PHP certification (as I'm not certified), but could give an opinion on which appears more tidy/formatted and thus easier to follow, provided you understand what the heck is going on. Using LotGD again as a reference (not a competitor, it's an online game), when I attempted to look at the source a few different times, it was a total disaster. No attempt at all to format or label the coding at all (no comments, no tabbing/spacing to make it easier to read, etc). Even someone without any programming experience would be able to look at it and when comparing it to organized programming, could tell you that the organized programming is easier to follow, even if they don't know what its doing.

For the features, in all different professions, businesses will adopt/adapt/borrow/'steal' ideas and put it into their own product/service/etc. The point I tried to make (and I admit that I failed miserably at it), aside from the first to have unlimited forums within forums, was how at one point vB had tried to claim it was the first to come up with certain ideas/concepts when it had already been introduced/announced on IPB. I forget what the features were exactly, just know that it was something underhanded. Not the first time that one company has done something like that, won't be the last and it's common enough that it's not too surprising when it happens.

So wasn't bashing (or attempting to) vB, just stating certain facts. :) In the end when all is said and done, so long as a product works, that's what many people look at and then go with what they feel is best for them, regardless of the inner workings.

[Fishfish0001]

Persoanlly I just like IPB better because it was the first Forum Software I looked at. Im pickey about the way things work, and VB/PHPBB have always annoyed me for some reason :P

[Collin1000]

As for "Coding Styles" I would say that when I write custom scripts or websites, I write them in the "style" of IPB 1.3.
(personally, i dislike the way IPB3 is written. Its too much hassle to go $this->lang->words['partial_login'] ...some of these classes and functions seem pointless for the simplicity of the task at hand....)

Back during the 1.3 days was when I first started to look at PHP code. (If you were around back then, youll remember how installing a mod required you to make 40+ file edits)

Had it not been for IPB, I doubt I would have ever learned PHP.

[Wolfie]

Back during the 1.3 days was when I first started to look at PHP code. (If you were around back then, youll remember how installing a mod required you to make 40+ file edits)

Some required just a couple of edits, others required lots of edits. Sometimes the edits were really simple (just tedious because of doing lots of simple edits in lots of files) and some were really complex (finding the right chunk of code and then either replace with a chunk of code or adding a chunk of code before/after the other code). Installing a mod where its action causes conflicts with other mods would be fun. Heaven forbid you try to install a mod where the file edits conflict with other file edits of other mods, discovering this AFTER you made all the other necessary edits. Don't even want to think about trying to UNINSTALL a mod.

Phew..

[Brian Garcia]

Oh man I remember the mod edits back in the day. Installing a simple mod alone could take a good 10-20 minutes. Installing Apps, etc for 3.0 is so much easier than previous versions.

[Collin1000]

Some required just a couple of edits, others required lots of edits. Sometimes the edits were really simple (just tedious because of doing lots of simple edits in lots of files) and some were really complex (finding the right chunk of code and then either replace with a chunk of code or adding a chunk of code before/after the other code). Installing a mod where its action causes conflicts with other mods would be fun. Heaven forbid you try to install a mod where the file edits conflict with other file edits of other mods, discovering this AFTER you made all the other necessary edits. Don't even want to think about trying to UNINSTALL a mod.

Phew..

You left out whenever there was an IPB update, you had to do it all again!

Oh man I remember the mod edits back in the day. Installing a simple mod alone could take a good 10-20 minutes. Installing Apps, etc for 3.0 is so much easier than previous versions.

Oh... the memories....
I installed both these bad boys back in my day.
Shop/Battle mods were the most file edits.

http://collin1000.com/Fresh%20Install.html
http://collin1000.com/1.5.0%20fresh%20install.html

[mld11]

There's only one simple reason that originally made me choose to continue my board from an IPB persepective, rather than vB:

Support and ACP Skinning.

I LOVE great support, because I like to ask a lot of questions so I will remember and understand it more as I learn in life (yes, I have a good memory, when I need it). The vB ACP looks like crap (I have run a website with vB before, it wasn't good at all); and the IPB ACP (the "back end") is extremely colorful and user friendly.


It's worth every cent I spend on them.