sedated Posted October 18, 2009 Posted October 18, 2009 Preface: This is not a rant or flame, but the hope of appealing to the IPB powers that be for a mutual beneficial opportunity. If there was ever a time to significantly increase your forum owner customer base and also do right by what is probably many thousands of people, you have an extraordinary opportunity - especially during this lasting recession depression. As you know, the creation and success of a forum is hard work and also an investment in the platform you own. This past week a confusing and misleading email was sent to existing vBulletin forum owners about an amazing upgrade offer to the new vBulletin product and a discontinuence of its old support policy. When the smoke cleared, it became apparent that Jelsoft, now known as Internet Brands, a NASDAQ company, is now demanding that owners of vBulletin forums pay practically the same price to "upgrade" their vBulletin forums as new customers. If customers don't "upgrade" now to an entirely new product which has no demo or release date, their ownly choice is to practically pay for an entirely new forum since the existing customer "discount" is a mere $20 of the cost of the vBulletin 4 forum which is $195. Forcing your customers to pay 89.7% of the price of the new software is an outrageous, disgraceful customer disservice, especially when the new software isn't even out of alpha testing. Many of the long time vBulletin users who helped create "vBulletin.org", the large vBulletin modification site, are now regretting that decision greatly. In addition to the digust towards the evil empire of forum software, the practicality of upgrading vBulletin software quite simply is not there. This is where Invision Power Services can increase its user base signficantly by offering some discount pricing to current vBulletin owners or by crossgrading. Many vBulletin forum owners would sooner crossgrade to Invision Power Board and wipe their hands clean of the entire Internet Brands vBulletin pricing fiasco and avoid what could be even more punishing practices in the future with annual or semi-annual vBulletin upgrades regarding more payments. Please consider this opportunity.
Management Charles Posted October 18, 2009 Management Posted October 18, 2009 Our pre-sales forum is full of converts and our sales email box is quite full so we are very much aware of the unhappiness of existing clients of vB. We currently have a package deal for our entire product line. You can read about it here: http://community.invisionpower.com/topic/296837-ip-content-1-1-and-community-suite-promotion/ We will certainly look into other options early this week :)
stoo2000 Posted October 18, 2009 Posted October 18, 2009 There is already a promotion on going if you look in Customer News http://community.invisionpower.com/topic/296837-ip-content-1-1-and-community-suite-promotion/
Sledgstone Posted October 18, 2009 Posted October 18, 2009 [quote name='Charles' date='18 October 2009 - 09:48 AM' timestamp='1255880916' post='1868377'] Our pre-sales forum is full of converts and our sales email box is quite full so we are very much aware of the unhappiness of existing clients of vB. We currently have a package deal for our entire product line. You can read about it here: http://community.invisionpower.com/topic/296837-ip-content-1-1-and-community-suite-promotion/ We will certainly look into other options early this week :) That seems like a nice offer, but I don't need the downloads or content feature. But if the Community Suite itself goes on sale for less than $249 in the next couple weeks, you'll have me as a customer. ;)
Management Charles Posted October 18, 2009 Management Posted October 18, 2009 Community Suite is Board/Blog/Gallery with a discount of up front price AND the renewals - we can't make it much cheaper ;)
sedated Posted October 18, 2009 Author Posted October 18, 2009 [quote name='stoo2000' date='18 October 2009 - 07:48 AM' timestamp='1255880917' post='1868378'] There is already a promotion on going if you look in Customer News http://community.invisionpower.com/topic/296837-ip-content-1-1-and-community-suite-promotion/ Thanks for the information. While it's a good price to entice new users, people are looking not to lose the entire value of their forum investment. That's why crossgrades are popular, a way of bridging the gap and convincing people to drop their current license and start to invest in something new. Right now vBulletin owners can "upgrade" existing licenses for $130 and $190 for expired for their cms and forum and blog package. Paying $250 might sound good for new customers but for current vBulletin owners it's still too high. Currently customers will begrudgingly bite the bullet, pay Internet Brands the $130 or $190 and go without dinner for a few weeks. If there was a special offer that discounted that offer for current licenseholders of vBulletin, I'll bet you'll see many converts who will never go back to vBulletin or Internet Brands once switched over here. Once again, thank you for your consideration and extremely quick replies.
Rhett Posted October 18, 2009 Posted October 18, 2009 [quote name='sedated' date='18 October 2009 - 09:54 AM' timestamp='1255884842' post='1868401'] Thanks for the information. While it's a good price to entice new users, people are looking not to lose the entire value of their forum investment. That's why crossgrades are popular, a way of bridging the gap and convincing people to drop their current license and start to invest in something new. Right now vBulletin owners can "upgrade" existing licenses for $130 and $190 for expired for their cms and forum and blog package. Paying $250 might sound good for new customers but for current vBulletin owners it's still too high. Currently customers will begrudgingly bite the bullet, pay Internet Brands the $130 or $190 and go without dinner for a few weeks. If there was a special offer that discounted that offer for current licenseholders of vBulletin, I'll bet you'll see many converts who will never go back to vBulletin or Internet Brands once switched over here. Once again, thank you for your consideration and extremely quick replies. Something to consider is the total out of pocket expense over a few years... looking at IPB in this manner will show you the reduction in future cost with IPB vs VB.... while it's a little more now... the renewals over the next 2-3 years are 25 bucks for 6 months... you don't have to renew every 6 months either... you can skip a few months or a year and then renew for 25 bucks... and get the latest version. Unlike the new vb license you will have to pay full price every year or two when they release a new version. Bottom line is yes if you want the full package it's a little more then vb to start but the renewals is where the benifit is.
IPZONE Posted October 18, 2009 Posted October 18, 2009 I have been hanging around here for days now and have given myself quite a headache trying to decide how to move forward. It is going to cost us at least $130 each site to 'upgrade' each of our VB licences but it's not that actual amount that I am especially objecting to but the very different way they want to handle support and upgrades. I don't feel at all comfortable with placing the future of our forums with IB/VB anymore - a simple trust thing (or lack of trust in fact). I also am uncomfortable spending such an amount with no demo to see and especially no timescale in place. Offsetting that 'problem' I also am not in a position to spend 3 lots of $250 to change to IPB and set my mind at rest. I suspect the change would create a huge amount of work for me but at least I might sleep a little easier in the long run. If I could change to IPB for the same cost as my VB upgrade would cost then I think it's a no brainer for me and many in my situation. As if the deadline that VB have placed on us wasn't bad enough I need to be out of the country for 10 days ( I leave in 2 days ) so my time is running out VERY rapidly and that's just adding to an already stressful situation. If you think you can do a deal for us VB'ers that want to get some trust back in our lives can you make it quick please :thumbsup:
Ditchmonkey Posted October 18, 2009 Posted October 18, 2009 [quote name='IPZONE' date='18 October 2009 - 10:25 AM' timestamp='1255890303' post='1868460'] Offsetting that 'problem' I also am not in a position to spend 3 lots of $250 to change to IPB and set my mind at rest. The IPB board is only 150. The suite is 250. However since vbulletin has an albums feature that would require IPB gallery to migrate that data, I think it would be a good idea for IPB to have a discounted package that includes forum and gallery to facilitate a proper migration of the VB forum to IPB.
sedated Posted October 18, 2009 Author Posted October 18, 2009 [quote name='Ditchmonkey' date='18 October 2009 - 10:41 AM' timestamp='1255891296' post='1868470'] The IPB board is only 150. The suite is 250. However since vbulletin has an albums feature that would require IPB gallery to migrate that data, I think it would be a good idea for IPB to have a discounted package that includes forum and gallery to facilitate a proper migration of the VB forum to IPB. Agreed. As I said, I can appreciate the sale discount. But if you want to take a HUGE number of vBulletin converts, including coders who will create a huge number of IPB add-ons which will steamroll into thousands more users, then I think the additional "limited time vBulletin crossgrade discount" makes incredible sense. For new owners, $250 is the price point. For current vBulletin owners, provide your verified license information and obtain an additional XX% discount to crossgrade. Understand this - Internet Brands will crucify their customers who will stay since the investment of $235 for a new license will be less painful than paying $250 for IPB software and then having to migrate. It's all about the long term effects. You may very well more than double your revenues in discounted crossgrades alone and then benefit from the huge following (as vBulletin did via vBulletin.org free add-ons) which results in far more sales and willingness to pay and payment of the current maintenance fees. This is a huge opportunity for IPB. Anyone can lower their price, especially with software that doesn't have the same fixed costs as hardware and physical items. The upside of a discount is tremendous and I can't imagine anyone, even IPB owners, would disagree. Help us help you. :D
sedated Posted October 18, 2009 Author Posted October 18, 2009 [quote name='Ditchmonkey' date='18 October 2009 - 10:41 AM' timestamp='1255891296' post='1868470'] The IPB board is only 150. The suite is 250. However since vbulletin has an albums feature that would require IPB gallery to migrate that data, I think it would be a good idea for IPB to have a discounted package that includes forum and gallery to facilitate a proper migration of the VB forum to IPB. Agreed. Considering that a vBulletin "suite" costs $235 now and comparable later, current vBulletin owners would unfortunately have little incentive to pay more AND have the pain of migrating all their data to a new platform. If there was a competitive upgrade solution upon providing valid vBulletin license number (keep track of these numbers in the database along with domain), you'd have an incredible landslide of converts, each paying a price around the cost of your IPB board for the full suite that will bring in tremendous current and future revenues. Help us help you - this is an incredible opportunity for IPB. Unlike hardware, there aren't such 'fixed' costs with software. IPB has the power to provide a competitive upgrade. vBulletin became what it was because of vBulletin.org, a tremendous user community providing free hacks. Imagine being able to migrate away a tremendous number of those developers, all of whom would pay and sell your software. Then you immediately migrate away the current vB owners, many of whom would begin that path immediately. My guess is you will see an exponential increase in current revenues and new sales that you would otherwise not see. If it costs $130 to upgrade to the "vaporware vBulletin publishing suite" then think about a $1xx upgrade for the IPB publishing suite. Current vBulletin owners will migrate. It will be worth it to go through the pain and never look back. People... this is an incredible opportunity to capture the market. Think quickly. Don't think about how much of the sales you will "lose" by the discount - you wouldn't have them. Think about how many addition sales you will generate WITH the discount and the HUGE influx of "free mod" developers and new users by capturing the majority of the market share almost overnight.
Guest puertoblack2003 Posted October 18, 2009 Posted October 18, 2009 I'm a proud owner of ipb product.I'm still a vb owner soon to migrate everything over to ipb.I currently have 3 license, 2 expired but still good to use and 1 active.After the announcement that was made, i was very disappointed on how they treated there respected long time member as myself with there crazy prices.Sooooo after few days of thinking i decided to make my move to here.To most people they may think it don't make since to move to another product.But in our culture we always believe to always take care of our own especially a long time member.But apparently its business so my business is with ipb now. Aside from that...the admincp area appears to be a little confusing but I'm a fast learner...once i have everything setup i will move 3 of my site to this product.. pb
nydiver Posted October 18, 2009 Posted October 18, 2009 I always had both forums and I can tell you IPB is worth any amount to change over. Now they have a converter to take over photopost to Gallery also! Its a one solution forum. You wont need hacks running to make the forum complete. And its not only a cost factor that you should look at but a customer service issue and I wont say any thing bad about anyone because IPB is just better. IPB seems to take the high road and that's just the way they are. So look and make your choice not on how bad someone else is but how good IPB would be for you! If VBull serves you better than go that way. I changed over and have a dead VBull package that's worth nothing thanks to the new cost scale. I must say I felt it coming and got out early.
Carl M Posted October 19, 2009 Posted October 19, 2009 Im afraid i wonder why because you are unhappy with vbulletin why you think that IPS should help to bail you out? If its a case of being unhappy with vbulletin are you really going to stick around with them for a total of around $20-$50? :)
nealtz Posted October 19, 2009 Posted October 19, 2009 I realy hope that IPB considers an crossgrade offer for vB emigrants like Woltlab does for WBB. Because if i use the discount for the vB suite i have to pay 'only' $130 and get free support till the next major vB upgrade. For IP Board i have to pay $150, for the Blog $50 or for the suite $250. So the migration costs me besides lots of extra work additional $20 to $120 and after six month i have to pay more money for the renewal. Maybe IPB can oblige current vB owners with a little extra discount. Maybe they can reduce their work and decrease the service offer so that the customers must install IPB by themenselfes.
MGSteve Posted October 19, 2009 Posted October 19, 2009 I have to say, one of my first posts on here was suggesting a discount for VB Crossgraders. I wonder how a $130 sale on the IPS Community suite until the end of Oct would go down! I know where my 2x $130 would go...
darkon Posted October 19, 2009 Posted October 19, 2009 If there would be an offer for crossgrading that includes just the board and the gallery it would make my decision a lot easier... I like the kind of wbb-offer (but i just don´t look wbb). The will give you an addon for up to 40 Euro if you crossgrade until end of december. You have to prove your crossgrade with a screenshot before and after you migrated.
Management Charles Posted October 19, 2009 Management Posted October 19, 2009 As with any business, we have a natural drive to want to increase our customer base. We have an offer you can read about in our announcements forum. We must also balance that natural drive for more customers with our commitment to our existing customers. They expect constant development and good support which we will continue to provide. In fact, due to the dozens of conversions each day over the past week we are adding two new customer service staff to keep up both with new demand and our existing customer needs. While we are never perfect, no one is, any IPS customer will tell you that we always do our best to serve their needs. IPS obviously wants to stay ahead of the game and maintain its market advantage in all areas. We cannot under-sell our own products and devalue their quality. Keep in mind we not only offer a product but a large bundle of services around it including private-ticket support, telephone support, our spam monitoring service, and the new live-chat product - all included with the license at no extra cost. It's more than just a simple message board we are selling here :)
IPZONE Posted October 19, 2009 Posted October 19, 2009 Thanks for our reply but this is now not relevant for me in any case - 79 hours have now passed since I sent an email to your sales team with no reply and 34 hours with no reply to a PM sent to an Admin on these forums. I know you guys are busy but for me that is not really quite what I am looking for - maybe next time. Thanks to those that did answer my questions though
Management Charles Posted October 19, 2009 Management Posted October 19, 2009 Do you have a ticket number? There are no sales emails that old in our system so either we didn't get it or you didn't get our reply. We're certainly replying to emails a whole lot faster than 79 hours :) You can also feel free to PM me.
Management Matt Posted October 19, 2009 Management Posted October 19, 2009 My apologies, the PM was sent to me. Generally speaking, PMing is the slowest way to get an answer. As per my reply, I can't find your email in our system at all but I did locate your old account.
IPZONE Posted October 19, 2009 Posted October 19, 2009 Thanks for the reply - I am just reading your PM now
Bluesplinter Posted October 19, 2009 Posted October 19, 2009 Heh, I created my own crossgrade... I sold my vB licenses, and now I have cash, which is just as good as money. :) I'm only waiting for the new sales process to go into effect next month (discount based on the more products you purchase at once). Steve
rct2·com Posted October 19, 2009 Posted October 19, 2009 And that's a very good point. People wishing to cross grade for a significant discount over existing loyal InVision customers seem to be forgetting in their arguments that they will still own a vB licenses for the current version of vB. Although they may not intend to use it as their main board, it does still have a residual value which could be realised by selling it on.
.Ian Posted October 19, 2009 Posted October 19, 2009 There is no real value in an old style vb licence as too many are selling them. I have them to sell and they are not worth a lot. I would rather convert mine to IPB and put all my forums under the one software product. With such a discount, I could move them over. At the moment it is $130 to upgrade to the VB suite or $249 to convert to a similar offering here or $299 for the full works (current offer).
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