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PaulKet

Has the Coronavirus effected your life?

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1 hour ago, tonyv said:

Ah, I get it now. It would be very practical for everyone to just stop driving. But give something like the common cold a scary name and call it a pandemic (very scary), and shutting down the entire world becomes a must.  

You misunderstand my post, it’s purely  around the comparison of statistics with hypothetical example. And where did I mention anything about shutting down the world?

 And please reply without a sarcastic tone. That’ll get you nowhere in substantiating any part of your argument. 

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25 minutes ago, Aiwa said:

 And please reply without a sarcastic tone. That’ll get you nowhere in substantiating any part of your argument.

I disagree. Sarcasm is effective. And I don't need much of an argument with any of it. Throughout this entire topic it has not been difficult to demonstrate that this entire pandemic scare is nonsense. 

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5 hours ago, Davyc said:

This is just the tip of the iceberg, because once a business goes out of business the likelihood of it starting up again is pretty small.  Virgin airways are telling staff that they will have to take eight weeks unpaid leave; how are these people going to pay rent/mortgages and feed their families and pay utility bills, etc.  

Exactly. 😥

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Posted (edited)
5 hours ago, tonyv said:

I disagree. Sarcasm is effective. And I don't need much of an argument with any of it. Throughout this entire topic it has not been difficult to demonstrate that this entire pandemic scare is nonsense. 

It’s amazing the bubble you live in. I’m actually sort of envious, to be honest. Watching the world react this way to an unprecedented (in our lives) global event and being able to think “ehn, what a bunch of idiots” is truly an interesting approach to life.

My favourite part is that if this reaction is effective and doesn’t allow this virus to peak the way everyone is worried, you’ll be in here gloating about how you were right and everyone else was stupid. And personally, if that’s the outcome, I will be ecstatic. 

Edited by Morgin

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Posted (edited)
10 hours ago, tonyv said:

Ah, I get it now. It would be very practical for everyone to just stop driving. But give something like the common cold a scary name and call it a pandemic (very scary), and shutting down the entire world becomes a must.  

Exactly. The world would have never even lasted this long if people had that mentality in the past… that if anything has a chance of death then everyone should stay home and never go anywhere the rest of their lives.

ps I think I just finally saw 2 people at the grocery store walking around with masks on.

8 hours ago, Aiwa said:

You misunderstand my post, it’s purely  around the comparison of statistics with hypothetical example. And where did I mention anything about shutting down the world?

 And please reply without a sarcastic tone. That’ll get you nowhere in substantiating any part of your argument. 

Everyone is basing their claims of what will happen with this virus on hypothetical examples, as nobody knows. Again, ebola and sars has a MUCH greater death rate and nothing shut down. The flu every single year kills at least fifteen times what has died in the US from this virus currently. And the car fatalities isn't an irrelevant comparison because we know driving will cause way more deaths, but people aren't forced to stop driving. Would be very surprising if the virus doesn't do like the flu does and taper almost totally out any week now.

if people had gone to events, nobody is forcing others to then go around those same people if they get infected, so if someone is so worried, they can isolate and not get it.

Edited by Midnight Modding

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Posted (edited)
3 hours ago, Morgin said:

It’s amazing the bubble you live in. I’m actually sort of envious, to be honest. Watching the world react this way to an unprecedented (in our lives) global event and being able to think “ehn, what a bunch of idiots” is truly an interesting approach to life.

My favourite part is that if this reaction is effective and doesn’t allow this virus to peak the way everyone is worried, you’ll be in here gloating about how you were right and everyone else was stupid. And personally, if that’s the outcome, I will be ecstatic. 

Italy and other places have already shown how ineffective anything is at slowing it much, so if it does suddenly stop it will be because it was already going to. Other than the steps which everyone would use with any virus.... everyone is already supposed to stay home if they are sick.

Also, nobody is saying it's good that it's killing people, but only that other viruses do as well and the real death rate is probably around 1%, given how many people may have it and not have symptoms.

Edited by Midnight Modding

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2 hours ago, Midnight Modding said:

Again, ebola and sars has a MUCH greater death rate and nothing shut down.

You are wrong. There were 8,098 reported cases of SARs (worldwide) and 774 deaths. So far there have been 190,000 cases of the Coronavirus and 7,894 deaths. Ebola killed 11,310 people over the span of two years, the Coronavirus will surpass that number very soon.

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12 minutes ago, PaulKet said:

You are wrong. There were 8,098 reported cases of SARs (worldwide) and 774 deaths. So far there have been 190,000 cases of the Coronavirus and 7,894 deaths. Ebola killed 11,310 people over the span of two years, the Coronavirus will surpass that number very soon.

so now we're back to using totals instead of percentages? when I said the actual totals mattered most, people said only the percentages do.  So if we're using totals, the regular flu has killed far more this year and every year. And like I asked earlier, are we supposed to neve rhave businesses again if the virus is as bad every year from now on?

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2 minutes ago, Midnight Modding said:

And like I asked earlier, are we supposed to neve rhave businesses again if the virus is as bad every year from now on?

In the '70s & '80s, before the internet, we wouldn't have even known about these purported deaths. Life would have simply gone on. Tonight might've been bowling night. 

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Posted (edited)

Mortality rates vs the amount of people who get it are what's important. THAT's what matters here. What are MY chances of dying if "I"get it!

You can't compare SARS or MERS to Corona just because of the spread area and the areas those were mostly contained too. Also Look both of them up and see who was mostly effected.

Influenza A and B are better comparison models. Corona in the USA is still behind on the influenza A and B numbers. Maybe they will catch up, maybe they wont. I can tell you this, in my area specifically here in the USA I can tell you Corona is in extremely low numbers so far to influenza A and B, severely behind. Here's a up to date model that provides a up to date analysis of Corona, the locations and business names plus other vital information on a live map. Keep in mind, there's about 2 million people in this surrounding area. Confirmed cases, confirmed location cases and possible exposure locations.
Confirmed cases in my county comes to 19, confirmed exposure locations come to 32, possible exposure locations are 5. NO DEATHS so far.


https://dogis.maps.arcgis.com/apps/opsdashboard/index.html?fbclid=IwAR1PN8vb4R4X31hjA6LiQ9YY1OYR4ZRc-IxSA50cWKXkzpz9QADZvsEt7T0#/21bec056a9a6449abcca89a329868fd6

A little gem is also hidden in my locations map, can you tell what that is? I'll tell you, out of confirmed exposure locations, 10 of them are Walmart.... Do you want to keep your risks down? Then stay out of Walmarts! Start supporting Mom and Pops business's so their doors are still open in 4-6 weeks. I have been doing just that. No buying meat at Walmart for example, I go to a real butcher shop, that's just an example of 1 way I've been staying away from exposure locations. Do your normal grocery shopping at a smaller chain grocer, I go to one called Fareway.

If you're in the USA, play it smart, find a map like the example I left up above. Learn the locations where exposure risk is at and greater. Do your homework. You'll be much safer. This approach is not full proof of course, but it does lesson your chances.

On a lite note: No strip clubs are on the map above nor have ever been a exposure location 😄 

Edited by DesignzShop

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One other thing is that the panic from it is causing "more" social interactions because of how often we have to go to the stores before various times are in stock. I've gone in 3 different stores probably a combined 12 times in a few days.

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13 minutes ago, tonyv said:


One article in that link Tony rings true and stands out in my opinion. This is what I've been saying all along and the numbers where I live prove that beyond a shadow of doubt.

Quote

About 4,000 Americans have been Corona’d to date. Less than 2 percent of them – about 65 people as of March 15 – have died. This is not Happy News. But it is not the Black Death, either. During the 2019 flu season, millions of people got sick and at least 1,300 of them died. For some reason, the media did not herald the reaper; businesses weren’t closed – either by government edict or because their customers had been scared away by the media. It was just the flu. Most people who got it didn’t die and most of those who did die were close to dying anyway. The flu merely pushed them over the edge of the end-of-life cliff.

 

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Scarier than even dying from this common cold is this:

Quote

What’s not natural is the almost overnight pillow-snuffing of a healthy economy – the best economy Americans have had in years – for the sake of something that could end up doing no more harm to most people’s health than a bad flu season – and maybe less...

But the harm being summoned by the hysteria and the overreaction to it could prove fatal to everyone who doesn’t get the virus and everyone gets it and who recovers from it.

Not dead. But dead broke ...

The whole Corona Thing thing smells wrong. It is too convenient. It is too fast. It serves too many nefarious purposes. It may achieve what nahnlevven didn’t – and what the “climate crisis” seems unable to achieve, despite Herculean efforts toward that end: The corralling of the populace with its fear-addled, lowing consent. The destruction of the economic life of America – so as to impose the elite’s political agenda on Americans.

 

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Posted (edited)

Someone called in on the radio today saying the whole thing is a hoax and the dems invented it all and nobody is even dying. lol. The right says how dumb that is, but I realty wonder if the left would call out that dumb of a statement if everything was reversed. But anyyyway, don't want to get political.

Someone pointed out the same thing I've said... that once there is more testing, the numbers will inevitably go up, so the media will make it look like there is some explosion of cases, whereas it's just people who already had it, ie not some sudden spike in people getting it.

On a random note, if anyone gets tasty kake mini chocolate donuts where they are.... the april 27th batch is soooooooo good I had to buy 3 extra bags and will freeze a couple. Certain batches are extra good. Probably depend son weather, too, though. They must have not had these melt any.

Edited by Midnight Modding

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3 hours ago, Midnight Modding said:

One other thing is that the panic from it is causing "more" social interactions because of how often we have to go to the stores before various times are in stock. I've gone in 3 different stores probably a combined 12 times in a few days.

It’s taken you 2 years to build a PC though. I’d imagine buying ingredients for dinner is at least a multi-week affair. 

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Posted (edited)
4 hours ago, Morgin said:

It’s taken you 2 years to build a PC though. I’d imagine buying ingredients for dinner is at least a multi-week affair. 

that's when you know someone is making good points... people start with the personal insults instead of sticking to the topic. 🙂 

it's taken me 2 years because my current pc was originally seeming to be about to bite the dust, but after fixing the issue and (ironically) also getting dust out of it, it's been lasting, so it's given me the luxury of being able to be picky and wait for good deals on good parts before building.

I do take my time on buying things, though, because I like making the best decisions and getting good deals.

Edited by Midnight Modding

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Posted (edited)

I still haven't seen anyone answer how long businesses should be closed and everyone panicking if the virus remains the same. Forever? Nobody said the virus is a good thing, but just like with the flu at some point people have to accept that viruses happen. The fact that this is spreading as much as it is also shows that a lot of people apparently don't know how to act in public when sick... they should either be staying home or making extra sure not to cough every which way in public. Same with the flu... people who know they are sick go around others. So the most important part is still for the sick to be at home, not the rest being forced to. And the ones who have the virus and don't know it would of course not be coughing and spreading it that way.

edit: what's weird is a lot of fantasy baseball leagues aren't filling... you'd think with people at home more, they'd be filling more often, not less so. Maybe they're waiting until closer to when the season legit starts before deciding who they'd draft...

Edited by Midnight Modding

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Posted (edited)
7 hours ago, Midnight Modding said:

I still haven't seen anyone answer how long businesses should be closed and everyone panicking if the virus remains the same. Forever?

Have you heard the phrase “flattening the curve lately”? It’s been blasted all over the news and social media platforms. It’s also your answer. It’s still spreading exponentially, which in turn means the healthcare system will be overwhelmed, which leads to even more deaths, including people with other health issues. If you or a family member of yours suffers from a stroke tomorrow and no doctor has time to help, you (and the other armchair-scientist here) would maybe finally get it and stop writing all this crap.   
The virus can’t be stopped. The goal of the shut-downs down is to slow it down as much as necessary to keep the health-care system going and by that avoid tens of thousands of unnecessary deaths. That’s it.

And all of that is completely different to expected seasonal infections, which don’t overwhelm the health-care system, because they are, well, expected. So stop making that comparison guys! The graphs clearly show that the worst is yet to come. So comparing typical flu deaths per season (i.e. finished events) to current Covid-19 deaths is incredibly stupid, when the infection curve is still on a linear or even exponential climb with no end in sight. Seriously, does this even need explaining? Can’t you do math or read graphs?

And just because some people can do the math and think ahead doesn’t mean they are “panicking”. They have a reasonable expectation based on evidence. 
Yes, panic buying (essentially an emotional reaction rooted in fear) counts as panicking. Understanding what is about to happen is not. Those two things shouldn’t be lumped together so easily. Just because people take this seriously, doesn’t mean they are “panicking”. 

The shut-downs need to last as long as necessary to achieve the mentioned goal. Because the consequences of not doing it (i.e. tens of thousands of avoidable deaths) are of course more severe than other things like lost profits. Again, does this even need explaining? Do you rather want to earn less money next month or bury your family members? It’s not that hard. 
Once countries are over the peak and vaccines are in place for the expected coming waves, things can of course get back to normal. 

Quote

just like with the flu at some point people have to accept that viruses happen. The fact that this is spreading as much as it is also shows that a lot of people apparently don't know how to act in public when sick...

Just more “arm-chair expert” opinion. Stop it. You aren’t a doctor or virologist. You have no idea what you are talking about. Either you can provide scientific sources for your claims or you shouldn’t make them. The incubation period of this virus is long enough (several days, maybe even up to 14 days or more) so it can constantly spread through people who don’t even have symptoms yet. That’s why the shut-downs and the social distancing are the only way to slow it down considerably. Just reacting after the symptoms (which is essentially your claim) has demonstrably not worked. That’s what Italy tried. So your opinion on that isn’t just demonstrably wrong, it’s even dangerous. You could have it right now and have already infected others with nothing else than touching door knobs, while giving us your opinion here on how sick people supposedly should behave. 

Go with that data and Listen to the science guys, not uninformed opinions (as in this topic) of people, who have no background in health or science and who’s opinions don’t align with reason and the facts. 

Edited by opentype

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6 minutes ago, opentype said:

Have you heard the phrase “flattening the curve lately”? It’s been blasted all over the news and social media platforms. It’s also your answer. It’s still spreading exponentially, which in turn means the healthcare system will be overwhelmed, which leads to even more deaths, including people with other health issues. If you or a family member of yours suffers from a stroke tomorrow and no doctor has time to help, you (and the other armchair-scientist here) would maybe finally get it and stop writing all this crap.   
The virus can’t be stopped. The goal of the shut-downs down is to slow it down as much as necessary to keep the health-care system going and by that avoid tens of thousands of unnecessary deaths. That’s it.

And all of that is completely different to expected seasonal infections, which don’t overwhelm the health-care system, because they are, well, expected. So stop making that comparison guys! The graphs clearly show that the worst is yet to come. So comparing typical flu deaths per season (i.e. finished events) to current Covid-19 deaths is incredibly stupid, when the infection curve is still on a linear or even exponential climb with no end in sight. Seriously, does this even need explaining? Can’t you do math or read graphs?

And just because some people can do the math and think ahead doesn’t mean they are “panicking”. They have a reasonable expectation based on evidence. 
Yes, panic buying (essentially an emotional reaction rooted in fear) counts as panicking. Understanding what is about to happen is not. Those two things shouldn’t be lumped together so easily. Just because people take this faeces seriously, doesn’t mean they are “panicking”. 

The shut-downs need to last as long as necessary to achieve the mentioned goal. Because the consequences of not doing it (i.e. tens of thousands of avoidable deaths) are of course more severe than other things like lost profits. Again, does this even need explaining? Do you rather want to earn less money next month or bury your family members? It’s not that hard. 
Once countries are over the peak and vaccines are in place for the expected coming waves, things can of course get back to normal. 

Just more “arm-chair expert” opinion. Stop it. You aren’t a doctor or virologist. You have no idea what you are talking about. Either you can provide scientific sources for your claims or you shouldn’t make them. The incubation period of this virus is long enough (several days, maybe even up to 14 days or more) so it can constantly spread through people who don’t even have symptoms yet. That’s why the shut-downs and the social distancing are the only way to slow it down considerably. Just reacting after the symptoms (which is essentially your claim) has demonstrably not worked. That’s what Italy tried. So your opinion on that isn’t just demonstrably wrong, it’s even dangerous. You could have it right now and have already infected others with nothing else than touching door knobs, while giving us your opinion here on how sick people supposedly should behave. 

Go with that data and Listen to the science guys, not uninformed opinions (as in this topic) of people, who have no background in health or science and who’s opinions don’t align with reason and the facts. 

👏🏻👏🏻👏🏻👏🏻👏🏻
Thank you for taking the time and making the effort to do this post. I just couldn’t bring myself to combat the insanity being displayed by these people in this thread. 

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This topic is an outlet for people who are obviously concerned about what is happening.  None of us are experts, but there have been many questions raised which have not been answered in a timely manner by those who we look to for advice.  Some of the questions raised can't be answered because there are too many unknowns.  Advice is now, at least here in the UK, filtering through and our Government is giving daily televised updates as to what measures are being taken.  Sadly, the advice being given is not being heeded and people are still panic buying.  I went to do a normal weekly shop today and you would think a swarm of locusts had ravaged the supermarket; it was unbelievable and the ones I felt the most sympathy and empathy for and with, were the elderly who looked bewildered at the empty shelves. Almost every department was stripped bare.

The virus is one thing, people are another - it's people that we need to fear more than the virus because they are acting out of blind panic and hysteria.  How long will it be before the news is telling us of people being mugged, or murdered, for a pack of toilet rolls, or pasta?  There have already been videos posted on SM showing how people are prepared to debase themselves for a pack of toilet rolls - it's disgusting and, quite frankly, in many ways it makes me feel ashamed to be part of the human race. At least during the world wars people came together to help each other and share what they had with their friends and neighbours - the community spirit that was alive and thriving then is lost today.

I can only hope that this virus is contained, controlled and eventually neutralised in a timely manner and that people will look back with shame as to how they acted and reacted, but somehow I doubt it.  Sad times, strange times and definitely not the world that I envisaged as a young boy.  I will be retiring this year when I reach 66 years of age, if I am lucky.

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Posted (edited)
2 hours ago, tonyv said:

I wonder how many children have died from it so far. Some expert, please post the numbers. 

Notice how they can't just stick to the facts or even their opinions. they throw in insults such as implying I can't "do the math" and to listen to experts. I am known for my good math skills and experts have said they don't know what will happen. If it reaching the "top of the curve" is all that matters then how come they say we're only 2 weeks behind Italy and Italy is at the top of theirs already, yet they canceled stuff for 8 weeks out? My math skills tell me that if our top of the curve is 2 weeks away and we only need to do this until then, 8 is greater than 2. And apparently my opinions are armchair opinions, but his opinions are facts, such as vaccines "being in place" just because some trials are going on. I'm so sure they magically got a good vaccine out so quickly and it will be a miracle worker for a virus. Oh and as far as background in science, I have a degree in a science and right in a textbook it was talking about limitations. He's responding as if I am the only one believing these things when the majority does.

And supposedly panic isn't going on... Grocery shelves bare and businesses being ruined forever over something with a lower death rate than a lot of other things. Look at the huge number of cancer cases and probably most are caused my manmade chemicals that still are allowed.

Edited by Midnight Modding

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Posted (edited)
2 hours ago, opentype said:

Go with that data and Listen to the science guys, not uninformed opinions (as in this topic) of people, who have no background in health or science and who’s opinions don’t align with reason and the facts. 

Oh for goodness sakes, you left a link to a neurological doctors opinion, not even a virologist! Here, get educated from a leading source
https://www.businessinsider.com/read-what-a-virologist-is-telling-family-coronavirus-guido-vanham-2020-3

AS I SAID PREVIOUSLY!! And out of the article I left above
It's the "death rate" you need to look at... AGAIN, as I said before.
Armchair opinions like yours is dangerous!

2 hours ago, opentype said:

Just more “arm-chair expert” opinion. Stop it. You aren’t a doctor or virologist. You have no idea what you are talking about. Either you can provide scientific sources for your claims or you shouldn’t make them.

Exactly, you have no clue either! Your even worse than some here leaving a article from a neurological opinion.

From the article I left from a leading virologist in the world.

Quote

Now, we do have to be careful in interpreting the death rate of this virus. It is indeed low (less than one percent) for people like you, but you should still consider you can get severely ill.


My information was directly from the CDC, not some opinion from a neurologist. Now you're hearing from a leading virologist in the world!

Quote

And we can't predict yet if the #coronavirus COVID-19 will ever become "like the flu" in mortality rates and immunity: it may indeed become weaker over time, as we develop immunity against it. That would be the best case scenario. And we may well develop a vaccine against it within a year's time, solving the problem as well.

AGAIN, as I said previously, the influenza situation is currently more dangerous. Is there a chance corona could pass influenza, yes it could, in some areas it also has a chance to not do that. AS I SAID BEFORE, people should be as concerned with influenza as much as they are about corona. Keep in mind the world has not shut down for influenza even though the death rates are higher currently mostly across the globe. I can tell you for a fact where I live, influenza is doing more damage than corona and even at the curve influenza is higher.

This is pretty simple, wash your hands, keep informed of locations where the virus has been identified and stay away from those areas and practice some social distancing. Pretty simple.

 

2 hours ago, opentype said:

Go with that data and Listen to the science guys, not uninformed opinions (as in this topic) of people, who have no background in health or science and who’s opinions don’t align with reason and the facts. 

A link to a 404 page and a link to a neurological article and doc, just stop with your as usual greater than thou stuff.

By the way, my wife is directly connected and works in the medical field getting top information from the cdc, US gov't outlets and more. I hear about this daily and see things most here could only dream of. I can stand behind everything I've posted. Can you??

Precaution is always good but remember, there is a curve here and that curve will falter soon. 
As more proof you can take a look at Chinas numbers right now. this is the largest population in the world..
 

Quote

Coronavirus Cases:
80,894
Deaths:
3,237
Recovered:
69,614

China today has 14 cases live... 14 CASES!!! This proves the curve is fast even in the worst situations like China. Here, see for yourself
 https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/country/china/

And another tidbit I mentioned previously!
https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/health/2020/01/24/coronavirus-versus-flu-influenza-deadlier-than-wuhan-china-disease/4564133002/
So when people like opentype tell you
 

Quote

And all of that is completely different to expected seasonal infections, which don’t overwhelm the health-care system, because they are, well, expected. So stop making that comparison guys!

Don't listen to them, comparisons are relevant, in a BIG way! Our systems in the USA have been geared for this for a long time as we deal with larger numbers of influenza cases than wuhan every month.

Again, common sense goes far in stopping the infection of populations! This wouldn't be as bad of a global issue if China would of had it together to begin with. Before anyone else freaks out saying were in a more devastating situation than ever before, think twice and do your research. If you are from the USA, DON'T freak out. many places in the world have failed and done the wrong things for detection and prevention, we are doing GREAT with this, don't panic or listen to armchair warriors!

Edited by DesignzShop

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