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dissidia

Patreon connect?

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You need to find a developer to do this as a plugin/app and you can have him/her create exactly what you want. 
I couldn’t see why this would be a stock feature, since there isn’t really a logical connection between the Patreon service and running an IPS community. 

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I actually do utilize Patreon myself, though I wasn't aware there was an API like this for it.

I might look into creating a plugin for this. I'll probably wait for 4.2.x to go stable though, since it offers much more powerful group promotion filters, it should be possible to have the plugin to hook directly into that system.

Edited by Makoto

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4 hours ago, opentype said:

You need to find a developer to do this as a plugin/app and you can have him/her create exactly what you want. 
I couldn’t see why this would be a stock feature, since there isn’t really a logical connection between the Patreon service and running an IPS community. 

If IPS expressed disinterest in Patreon integration then yeah, the next step would be going 3rd party. It's just that Patreon is a fast-growing service practically ideal to combine with this software, so official support would be great.

4 hours ago, Makoto said:

I actually do utilize Patreon myself, though I wasn't aware there was an API like this for it.

I might look into creating a plugin for this. I'll probably wait for 4.2.x to go stable though, since it offers much more powerful group promotion filters, it should be possible to have the plugin to hook directly into that system.

Feel free to post your update on writing the plugin in this thread, I'd like to get notified if you realize this. Or link a space where you'll announce it.

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14 hours ago, opentype said:

You need to find a developer to do this as a plugin/app and you can have him/her create exactly what you want. 
I couldn’t see why this would be a stock feature, since there isn’t really a logical connection between the Patreon service and running an IPS community. 

 

Why wouldn't there be a logical connection between Patreon and running IPS.... or are you only thinking of Forums?  I just signed up as a Patreon of McMansion Hell and all it is is a Tumblr blog. 

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1 hour ago, CheersnGears said:

Why wouldn't there be a logical connection between Patreon and running IPS....

The burden of proof is on the ones making the positive claim. Which I am not. 
The question is: How is this functionality either …

  • a typical feature for people already running an IPS community. Who has both an IPS community and a Patreon Creator account? Is that a significant number? I really doubt it. There isn’t even a stock Mailchimp API connect for example. That’s the stuff that “logically connects”, because almost any community owner sends out newsletters. 
  • or a substantial market for IPS in regards to targeting Patreon Creators to build their community/reward structure on an IPS site. But Patreon has the community & reward infrastructure built into their site already. Why would IPS go specifically after that? 

So, I just don’t see any of these two options apply “logically”. Patreon is one of thousands of online services around the word that could potentially connect to IPS and make a few users very happy with that. (Yes, I can easily see the usefulness for some admins.) But I just don’t see how it logically connects (for a significant amount of users) and as a result: make it worthwhile for IPS to implement. That’s why I wanted to say: Don’t hold your breath waiting for an official support. Rather go the developer route directly. Just my recommendation/opinion of course. I have nothing against Patreon or a Patreon API connection. 

Edited by opentype

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It's worthwhile because it is about the best way of financing an IPS-powered website that doesn't sell products or services, i.e. is funded by donations. Patreon has already partnered up with services like Discord, which could use the same arguments for and against.

Anyway, seems like third party will be the way to go. Although, IPS—if you happen to see this—I warmly recommend being on a lookout as for Patreon's growth and influence over content-creating communities.

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23 hours ago, opentype said:

The burden of proof is on the ones making the positive claim. Which I am not. 
The question is: How is this functionality either …

  • a typical feature for people already running an IPS community. Who has both an IPS community and a Patreon Creator account? Is that a significant number? I really doubt it. There isn’t even a stock Mailchimp API connect for example. That’s the stuff that “logically connects”, because almost any community owner sends out newsletters. 
  • or a substantial market for IPS in regards to targeting Patreon Creators to build their community/reward structure on an IPS site. But Patreon has the community & reward infrastructure built into their site already. Why would IPS go specifically after that? 

So, I just don’t see any of these two options apply “logically”. Patreon is one of thousands of online services around the word that could potentially connect to IPS and make a few users very happy with that. (Yes, I can easily see the usefulness for some admins.) But I just don’t see how it logically connects (for a significant amount of users) and as a result: make it worthwhile for IPS to implement. That’s why I wanted to say: Don’t hold your breath waiting for an official support. Rather go the developer route directly. Just my recommendation/opinion of course. I have nothing against Patreon or a Patreon API connection. 

Patreon is superior to Paypal in a number of ways and with the insignificant amount of effort involved in signing up as a Patreon Creator means the need to have both currently is an entirely moot point.  If Patreon connect were offered as a payment option through IPS, I'd have the PC account created in less than 5 minutes. 

Linking Patreon to subscription or service levels as a reward is elementary. Setting a $1.25 per month reward level that eliminates ads would be where I'd start... and higher levels that offered additional access or early access to content or secret clubs.... Not. Everyone. Runs. Just. A. Forum.  The biggest part of my sites runs on Pages. 

I often find the blindness to the potential of IPS so frustrating.  Most everything outside the focus of Forums is only 75% thought through.

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1 hour ago, CheersnGears said:

I often find the blindness to the potential of IPS so frustrating.  Most everything outside the focus of Forums is only 75% thought through.

Yeah, thanks for jumping from “he has a different opinion” to “so he must be blind” and the silly assumption of “having a narrow on forums”, which is completely untrue and nowhere suggested in my posts. I’m out. Not going to waste my time with such an dishonest debate style. 

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4 hours ago, opentype said:

 

Yeah, thanks for jumping from “he has a different opinion” to “so he must be blind” and the silly assumption of “having a narrow on forums”, which is completely untrue and nowhere suggested in my posts. I’m out. Not going to waste my time with such an dishonest debate style. 

Every single suggestion I and most others put forward you shoot down as being unneeded.  You often take the position here that just because you would never use it, none of the rest of us should want to either. However, my frustrations are not just with you, but with IPS as well. 

The Forums app is class leading. Pages, Blogs, and Gallery, not so much.  Pages in particular has the power to be a Wordpress killer if only it weren't 75% finished in that regard.

You love to beat the "It's not core functionality" drum all the time.  Fine, then either IPS needs to start developing their own additional plug-ins outside of core or they need to offer some sort of additional incentive to get 3rd parties to start developing some.  Having to go out and find a developer for every single add-on or plug-in and then only have a 50/50 chance of ongoing support for that add-on is not tenable.  No developer is going to want to take up building this Patreon payment gateway because there is no way for them to see any demand for it. Site owners can't/won't pay $400 for a one off plug-in to get it started.

It's a chicken-egg problem... and having you come in and push down any and all requests is supremely unhelpful.  If you don't want to use the idea floated... just let it go and leave the debate to the people who do want it.

 

 

Edited by CheersnGears

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This is heading into unnecessarily negative territory, so let me further elaborate on why Patreon support is welcome (or even essential).

I feel like Patreon is to continuous projects what Kickstarter is to one-time ones. It's not some completely niche service, as content creators are massively converting to utilize it over other methods of funding. Millions of dollars go through Patreon every month and the service is only growing. I invite you to read more about this on its Wikipedia page.

As for the justification—I feel like users would actually be incentivized to support their communities through this well-known platform, perhaps even moreso than direct PayPal or the like. Offering your community a funding option through Patreon can sound reassuring, because your patrons a part of this system which helps many content creators like you or your community may be.

Edited by dissidia

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Patreon is finally at the stage of fairly mainstream acceptance. My non-tech friends know about it and many have subscribed to various things they have come across in their facebook day to day lives that utilize it. It's all around content creators finding revenue streams.

To me, it's a no brainer for inclusion on IPS's list of "how can we help our users monetize their communities to keep them incentivized to continue to pay for our software" items, but there's only so many development resources to go around, which is just a reality.

I would absolutely love Patreon integration though. I'm not interested in dealing with stripe and all that just for a subscription service to my site, but if it was tied to Patreon who does all the payment stuff for you, and has the credibility and trust for this type of stuff, AND it could handle group promotion/demotion automatically, that would just be a fantastic revenue sweetener.

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I would also like to see Patreon integration. I see people using it all over now. YouTube, Twitter, personal websites, and Discord chat groups just to name a few places. 

Edited by JoshB84

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News:

https://blog.patreon.com/patreon-powers-membership-across-the-web

Quote

That’s why, today, we’re launching a new dimension to the Patreon platform. With our new App Directory for creators and Developer Portal, we’re making it easy to connect all of your communities and favorite tools with Patreon so that you can run one streamlined membership business.

The App Directory makes it easy for creators to connect tools that help them grow their membership businesses, and energize patrons.

Our Developer Portal offers all the details that technical creators and partners need to build amazing tools that help creators run their membership business.

https://patreon.com/apps

https://patreon.com/portal

This is getting really competitive really fast. Discourse's already on it — officially.

I love Invision for how feature-rich it is, but if I was looking for just a message board software and saw Discourse having what's becoming a major, or maybe even the, selling point, that's highly likely where I'd go.

Already posted a customization request over at marketplace for Patreon Connect but there doesn't seem to be any movement, so I come with this update to the thread I aimed at Invision devs. The first time I asked you to consider it, but now I'm asking you to please do it. If we have login handlers such as LinkedIn, for sure we should be able to have Patreon (granted, Patreon's a fair bit more complex of an integration than other are — but it's worth it).

Content creators can utilize Patreon and Invision to create and manage projects which provide with rewards for all parties. I'd prefer engaging my community in various ways over relying on ads just keep the site up. Best communities are niche ones, and their members are extremely loyal and supportive. Patreon allows for strengthening the connection between creators and their communities.

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@opentype @dissidia I am just chiming in too, Patreon integration (especially into Nexus) is now a must. One very compelling reason is that they handle EU VATMOSS so we don’t have to meaning selling services and taking money from the EU is now simple as can be.

Its time to act Invision.

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6 minutes ago, CSSlife said:

@opentype @dissidia I am just chiming in too, Patreon integration (especially into Nexus) is now a must. One very compelling reason is that they handle EU VATMOSS so we don’t have to meaning selling services and taking money from the EU is now simple as can be.

Its time to act Invision.

I am not seeing that the Patreon API even allows a connection to stores. It just delivers information about Patreon users and their pledges to Patreon Creators. So I am not sure what IPS should “act on” frankly.

I rather see the EU VatMOSS integrated into Commerce. That would help every Commerce user and make much more sense than moving the memberships to Patreon just to retrieve them again through an API and loose money to Patreon. 

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On 27/10/2017 at 7:10 PM, opentype said:

I am not seeing that the Patreon API even allows a connection to stores. It just delivers information about Patreon users and their pledges to Patreon Creators. So I am not sure what IPS should “act on” frankly.

I rather see the EU VatMOSS integrated into Commerce. That would help every Commerce user and make much more sense than moving the memberships to Patreon just to retrieve them again through an API and loose money to Patreon. 

Good points, but some of us don't have the time or money to do the extra accounting it would take to be EU VATMOSS compliant even if it was integrated into Commerce. Yes Patreon takes a cut, but they simplify the whole process saving us from having to handle invoices, vat and paying extra for accountancy meaning we can focus on just making money but that's just my two cents.

Patreon are already working with Wordpress, Discord and other major digital publishing platforms and considering IPS is now providing a variety of publishing software alongside forum software... having that patreon integration would be a useful tool maybe not for everyone but certainly for me and others who want to simplify their income streams.

Edited by CSSlife

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Even if Commerce is probably too costly for startups who only seek subscription system, the additional advantage of Patreon is networking. Patreon is a content creator hub, and its users are likely to back several projects through this platform, something they wouldn't usually do.

I see Commerce and Patreon working in conjunction rather than competing against each other.

Startups start off with Patreon, a huge and established platform, and when their site grows enough, they can add their own subscription option through Commerce. Both have merit.

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