jHz Posted October 9, 2016 Share Posted October 9, 2016 Version 3 had a whole section under /index.php?app=core&module=help that had a great help guide for members to reference. This is an essential need for members. I hope it wasn't removed. Does this still exist under version 4, and where? If not, is it going to return? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ABGenc Posted October 9, 2016 Share Posted October 9, 2016 This is discontinued. If you have pages application, it is easily implemented by creating a new database. If not you can use Question Forums ( as this forum is ) or regular forum topics. I have used both options in my two seperate sites. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bern5 Posted October 10, 2016 Share Posted October 10, 2016 so there is no help and support for members on actually using the forum - that sux Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jHz Posted October 13, 2016 Author Share Posted October 13, 2016 sigh. I'm a software engineer for 25 years and even I know documentation is a must have for any application. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
opentype Posted October 13, 2016 Share Posted October 13, 2016 11 minutes ago, Jack Hurwitz_8765 said: sigh. I'm a software engineer for 25 years and even I know documentation is a must have for any application. Desktop application perhaps, but you need a documentation for every website you visit and use? Really? Just look at the screenshot in the first post. People really need an explanation that in order to create an account you have to click on “Create an account”? This basic stuff should be self-explanatory anyway. And custom features and all your custom rules need to be explained by yourself anyway. You can just make a FAQ page easily or a FAQ section even (with Pages for example) and put down everything you want to let your users know about the use of your site. Much more useful than these old help sections in my opinion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jHz Posted October 17, 2016 Author Share Posted October 17, 2016 I cannot believe I have to say this here, of all places, BUT, In a community. Members come first. I have nothing else to say. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
opentype Posted October 17, 2016 Share Posted October 17, 2016 Maybe you should say a little more, because at least I have no idea what “members come first” should express. I mean, I understand the words, but if that should imply specific arguments or actions regarding stock help topics I don’t see them without better explanations. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Simon Woods Posted October 17, 2016 Share Posted October 17, 2016 You don't prioritise members by giving them the same documentation that every other IPS site has. Instead, you create documentation that is tailored to your site and represents your site with greater accuracy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mikeiw3001 Posted October 25, 2016 Share Posted October 25, 2016 As this software transcends being a "web page" and has some pretty powerful functionality that sometimes isn't wholly evident from the "blank page" of a posting window, I think that at least a basic Help system should be provided, which can be built upon by the user if they see fit. I run a board where the members come from all walks of life, and are of all age brackets, so a good proportion of them need some type of help to get to grips with the intricacies of the software. Assuming that everyone who manages to navigate to your forum will automatically be able to use it might work for some sites, but where the forum is a general use one, it's important not to forget that although we're immersed in this sort of thing day after day, some people might not come from an IT background, or even be familiar with forums. It's not just the older members either - I've had guys younger than me totally at a loss with some of the more involved aspects. Scoff all you want at their lack of ability, but these are our members, and they're the sole reason the forums exist. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Simon Woods Posted October 25, 2016 Share Posted October 25, 2016 40 minutes ago, Mikeiw3001 said: As this software transcends being a "web page" and has some pretty powerful functionality that sometimes isn't wholly evident from the "blank page" of a posting window, I think that at least a basic Help system should be provided, which can be built upon by the user if they see fit. I run a board where the members come from all walks of life, and are of all age brackets, so a good proportion of them need some type of help to get to grips with the intricacies of the software. Assuming that everyone who manages to navigate to your forum will automatically be able to use it might work for some sites, but where the forum is a general use one, it's important not to forget that although we're immersed in this sort of thing day after day, some people might not come from an IT background, or even be familiar with forums. It's not just the older members either - I've had guys younger than me totally at a loss with some of the more involved aspects. Scoff all you want at their lack of ability, but these are our members, and they're the sole reason the forums exist. I run a site that is open to literally anybody above the age of 18 and do not need IPS to hold my hand by providing boiler plate documents. I've had plenty of first-time forum users and generally casual internet users join my site and found the custom-made documentation to be helpful enough that they are now core members of the community. Also, who is scoffing? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mikeiw3001 Posted October 25, 2016 Share Posted October 25, 2016 My point was that a core documentation would have been helpful to build upon, to save everyone having to effectively re-invent the wheel, as good help files take a lot of time and effort to write. Scoffing by those that think everyone should be able to navigate a site like Invision without documentation built in - not you specifically. My site has quite a few retired members, and some of them aren't too hot with PCs, but they are talented when it comes to our hobby. I can't help thinking that it was a bit of a cop-out by Invision not to include any help files at all. Having a relatively small Mod team for a relatively large site, I'd have appreciated the basics. Are basic help files available to build on anywhere? I know a lot of people (self included) would appreciate the short-cut Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
opentype Posted October 25, 2016 Share Posted October 25, 2016 32 minutes ago, Mikeiw3001 said: Scoffing by those that think everyone should be able to navigate a site like Invision without documentation built in … But who said that? My argument was simply that the old stock help section is not a very good answer. I don’t expect every forum user to be an “IT guy” who knows everything. But I am having such sections since 15 years on my site(s) – with hardly any use. As I already said: Most of the text just explains the obvious. That’s not very helpful. The other half is vague, since the help texts aren’t actually honoring the specific site settings. The only thing that was used in the past on my sites was the description of bb codes, since that was something you really needed to look up – but that is obsolete now as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mikeiw3001 Posted October 25, 2016 Share Posted October 25, 2016 What's obvious to some ain't necessarily obvious to others. That's my point. Assuming a level of competence on a forum is untenable, and as I type this I'm helping a septuagenarian understand the little reputation bar under his avatar. Perhaps the perceived vagueness of the previous system was more of a symptom of the need for an overhauled help system, rather than throwing it out altogether. Surely some help is better than none out of the box? I don't particularly relish writing files and adding screenshots/pictures of the various elements for EVERY aspect of the forum's use. Help files are there to cater to those that don't know how to use the software... need I really say any more? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bern5 Posted October 25, 2016 Share Posted October 25, 2016 something is better than nothing - i have just upgraded my forum and there is heaps of members asking - how to do this? and whats that? and where did this go? at least a HELP section gave them a place to go and search for the answer before they would ask in the forum. Now i (and other members) have to manually answer each query and i dont have much time atm. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CP Posted October 25, 2016 Share Posted October 25, 2016 I am fine not having a help section. As some members have already posted most of it was basic stuff that members know anyway. I have been slowly building a Q&A section on my forum adding things that members ask often and it has been working really good. If someone asks a question I just post a link to the Q&A section. If it is a question I do not have posted, I create one in a matter of minutes then post a link. Even though it takes a bit of time to create a answer, it saves me more time in the long run not having to answer each question. My members never ask basic stuff, most questions are about other things like how to add a signature, questions on uploading, notifications etc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joel R Posted October 25, 2016 Share Posted October 25, 2016 Help File Management by @-RAW- For free in the Marketplace. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mikeiw3001 Posted October 25, 2016 Share Posted October 25, 2016 That's useful, thanks Joel. It is just an empty shell though (my install is at least), so still need to be populated, but it saves the creation of a Pages database, which is good for those without that app in their arsenal Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joel R Posted October 25, 2016 Share Posted October 25, 2016 3 hours ago, Mikeiw3001 said: That's useful, thanks Joel. It is just an empty shell though (my install is at least), so still need to be populated, but it saves the creation of a Pages database, which is good for those without that app in their arsenal You should refer to the help file or directly contact @-RAW- for support. I'm surprised that it's empty ... not very helpful with no help files, ha! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CherryGirl69 Posted October 27, 2016 Share Posted October 27, 2016 I miss this too!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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