Amy T Posted June 19, 2011 Share Posted June 19, 2011 ...and they still exist - there is a bug here preventing them from showing on topic page. Good then all is well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Management Matt Posted June 19, 2011 Management Share Posted June 19, 2011 I understand that removing features is always hard but the fact that there's only a few customers complaining over these removed items tells me we chose the right direction to go. I also understand that change is never easy for some to accept. But if we just churned out the same product year after year then we'd quickly become a dinosaur just like UBB and others have. We pride ourselves on listening to our customers and using that as a strong foundation for our direction and 3.2 is no exception. We listened carefully to what people have been saying over the last 18 months and almost all have asked for a cleaner, simpler product - and I feel we've delivered that without compromising on power or ability. Online/offline indicator, topic descriptions and other minor iconography aren't massive things in the grand scheme and as others have noted, our wonderful modifications community have already stepped in. This is a win-win: we streamline the product's interface (nothing to do with code bloat) and encourage our ecosystem to flourish. I honestly haven't seen the modification's community this invigorated for a while, so that's amazing to see. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Amy T Posted June 19, 2011 Share Posted June 19, 2011 I will admit I was wanting it to be simple or smaller as I noticed a resource ussage difference between 2.6 and 3.1. 3.1 used twice as much bandwidth as 2.6. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
4joys Posted June 19, 2011 Share Posted June 19, 2011 I'm happy with 90% of the features added and removed in 3.2. The other 10% I'll happily add the hooks. I appreciate the fact the IPB listens to the majority of it customers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Management Matt Posted June 19, 2011 Management Share Posted June 19, 2011 This is the point I want to stress. There seems to be some feeling that we've gone off at a tangent and we're forcing this on our customers who don't want it. That's simply not the case. We've listened to what our customers have told us and 3.2 is the result of that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hexsplosions Posted June 19, 2011 Share Posted June 19, 2011 I want dancing girls in 3.2. Make it happen please. :P On a serious note, I thought some of the changes were absurd... Then I thought about it. There are still some things I think are missing from IPB, but what I get in return is more than worth it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
.Ian Posted June 19, 2011 Share Posted June 19, 2011 On a serious note, I thought some of the changes were absurd... Then I thought about it. There are still some things I think are missing from IPB, but what I get in return is more than worth it. Totally :) I would much rather have a system whereby items can easily be added back in, than a system stuck in the last decade. I am used to reading posts on other forums about people unable to take advantage of the latest developments and their annoyance at the software platform not keeping pace. Hopefully a claim that cannot be levelled at IPB. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
qscott86 Posted June 19, 2011 Share Posted June 19, 2011 I understand that removing features is always hard but the fact that there's only a few customers complaining over these removed items tells me we chose the right direction to go. I also understand that change is never easy for some to accept. But if we just churned out the same product year after year then we'd quickly become a dinosaur just like UBB and others have. We pride ourselves on listening to our customers and using that as a strong foundation for our direction and 3.2 is no exception. We listened carefully to what people have been saying over the last 18 months and almost all have asked for a cleaner, simpler product - and I feel we've delivered that without compromising on power or ability. Online/offline indicator, topic descriptions and other minor iconography aren't massive things in the grand scheme and as others have noted, our wonderful modifications community have already stepped in. This is a win-win: we streamline the product's interface (nothing to do with code bloat) and encourage our ecosystem to flourish. I honestly haven't seen the modification's community this invigorated for a while, so that's amazing to see. I think Matt makes a good point. I think people need to see the bigger picture. The truth is there is nothing they can ever do to satisfy everyone-- because we all like different things and different features are important to different people. I am hearing a lot of silly whining over minuscule things like "the quote button isn't the right color" or "this button isn't where I want it". That is what skinning is for -- you have the ability to tweak the minutia as you will. I very much love the way things look right now and it isn't fair to expect them to tweak small things for your own benefit and then alienate others ... there must be a happy medium. In regards to the Online indicator, that is unnecessary in topic view. You can mouseover a person's name and see if they are online -- it does not need to repeat that indicator over and over for each post. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aisha Posted June 19, 2011 Share Posted June 19, 2011 I've tried personally to not only release hooks for some of these features lost, but have helped several others who were getting into hook making do the same. If these efforts of mine are not appreciated, I'll stop, I've got other things I can devote my time to. Noooo I appreciate your help. I'm learning!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marklcfc Posted June 19, 2011 Share Posted June 19, 2011 This is the point I want to stress. There seems to be some feeling that we've gone off at a tangent and we're forcing this on our customers who don't want it. That's simply not the case. We've listened to what our customers have told us and 3.2 is the result of that. This is what people wanted? Well let's just see how many forums upgrade to 3.2 and how successful they are. (I still believe you should be supplying an alternative skin though - you did with 3.0, and the skin changes from 2.3 to 3.0 were nowhere near as massive as this) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
qscott86 Posted June 19, 2011 Share Posted June 19, 2011 This is what people wanted? Well let's just see how many forums upgrade to 3.2 and how successful they are. (I still believe you should be supplying an alternative skin though - you did with 3.0, and the skin changes from 2.3 to 3.0 were nowhere near as massive as this) Well, according to this poll: http://community.invisionpower.com/topic/339553-320-will-you-upgrade/ , nearly 77% of people polled plan to upgrade. 3.2 is leaps and bounds better than 3.1 As I've said many time, some people will complain about absolutely anything you do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Management Matt Posted June 20, 2011 Management Share Posted June 20, 2011 This is what people wanted? Well let's just see how many forums upgrade to 3.2 and how successful they are. (I still believe you should be supplying an alternative skin though - you did with 3.0, and the skin changes from 2.3 to 3.0 were nowhere near as massive as this) As above - the poll in the customer's forum shows that the "Yes (77%)" and "Undecided (12%)" total just under 90%. That's an amazing response which tells me 3.2 will be phenomenally successful with our own customers and with those currently looking to switch forum software. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Midnight Modding Posted June 20, 2011 Share Posted June 20, 2011 23% is a major major percentage to not be wanting to. It's one thing to say hey the majority wants this or that, but there aren't many companies who want one fourth of their customers against their direction. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marklcfc Posted June 20, 2011 Share Posted June 20, 2011 As above - the poll in the customer's forum shows that the "Yes (77%)" and "Undecided (12%)" total just under 90%. That's an amazing response which tells me 3.2 will be phenomenally successful with our own customers and with those currently looking to switch forum software. Have you not noticed how many large forums are still using 2.x? (I could name at least 10 with a million plus posts). Infact I'd guess that there are more busy large 2.x forums than 3.x even though they look quite out of date now. Of course it depends on the site/community, but also what the average user prefers.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AndyF Posted June 20, 2011 Share Posted June 20, 2011 23% is a major major percentage to not be wanting to. It's one thing to say hey the majority wants this or that, but there aren't many companies who want one fourth of their customers against their direction. The 'real' percentage would be substantially lower in my opinion. You have to remember that a large proportion of customers, especially corporate clients do not visit this forum. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Management Matt Posted June 20, 2011 Management Share Posted June 20, 2011 Indeed. The number of customers who actively use these forums is around 10% of our active license holders. We do receive a lot of feedback outside of the forums and it's almost all positive. Keep in mind, a lot of people in this topic are making assumptions about how their community may react without actually trying the software. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
.Ian Posted June 20, 2011 Share Posted June 20, 2011 I have already removed the topic description from my copy of 3.1.4 a week ago and not had a single moan yet! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Midnight Modding Posted June 20, 2011 Share Posted June 20, 2011 The 'real' percentage would be substantially lower in my opinion. You have to remember that a large proportion of customers, especially corporate clients do not visit this forum. True. I'm just saying if the real number were that it would be something to consider. I have no idea what the real percentage would be though. Like I've been saying I like most of 3.2. So I'm certainly not in the group who is mad about anything. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clickfinity Posted June 20, 2011 Share Posted June 20, 2011 I have already removed the topic description from my copy of 3.1.4 a week ago and not had a single moan yet! Would you mind posting how you did this? I'm doing exactly the same thing - removing the ability to add new topic descriptions, so that my board is "clear" of them before going live with 3.2 and everyone is used to not seeing them. Cheers, Shaun :D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Enkidu Posted June 20, 2011 Share Posted June 20, 2011 As above - the poll in the customer's forum shows that the "Yes (77%)" and "Undecided (12%)" total just under 90%. That's an amazing response which tells me 3.2 will be phenomenally successful with our own customers and with those currently looking to switch forum software. but you guys argue all the time that the percentage of customers visiting this forum is relatively small? or was that taken from somewhere else? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dr. Jekyll Posted June 20, 2011 Share Posted June 20, 2011 As above - the poll in the customer's forum shows that the "Yes (77%)" and "Undecided (12%)" total just under 90%. That's an amazing response which tells me 3.2 will be phenomenally successful with our own customers and with those currently looking to switch forum software. Sorry Matt, but one thing is to ask us in a pool if we will update our forums to ipb 3.2, another is to create a specific pool to ask us about each specific function that was removed/changed. Seeing that pool, we do not know how many said they would update their site to ipb 3.2 because they are happy with the new features you added (eg prefix and tags), or because if they remain firm for ipb 3.1 they couldn't update hook / mod and how many users will update to ipb 3.2 only because at this moment there are no alternatives to ipb (vB is in "bad water", xenforo is still too young and doesn't have yet any add on ). My two cents :) P.S. For the record I'll update to ipb 3.2 because I think that what's been added is worth much more than what has been taken Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TCWT Posted June 20, 2011 Share Posted June 20, 2011 I have already removed the topic description from my copy of 3.1.4 a week ago and not had a single moan yet! How did you do this? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ocean West Posted June 21, 2011 Share Posted June 21, 2011 interesting out of 78396 topics on my site only 740 actually have a topic Description. I'd say most of those were from a hook that copied part of the body into it. Since i've only been running on IPB 3 since last october I'd say less than 50 legitimate descriptions. and many of the contents the poster had repeated it in the body anyway. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clickfinity Posted June 21, 2011 Share Posted June 21, 2011 How did you do this?http://community.invisionpower.com/topic/313418-how-to-remove-topic-description-in-template-bit/page__view__findpost__p__2125885 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marcher Technologies Posted June 22, 2011 Share Posted June 22, 2011 Sigh... it would take something I utilize Site-building to make me hop this fence. As an IPContent Power-user/custom job-man I see IPB/IPC as a powerful set of tools that in many, many instances saves me time/re-inventing any wheels. With 3.2 this has been increased further with things like ipsLayout(no more having to css the layout myself, just utilize preexisting classes). (begin Rant) However, it does seem while you giveth, thou also simultaneously taketh away. in 3.1.x, to implement a horizontally tabbed layout was a js 1-liner calling the internal ipb scripts function and a bit of html markup. In 3.2 vertical tabs have wholesale replaced this functionality. I understand as few took the time to pay the proper attention to tab CSS to allow tidy wrapping, horizontal tabs could be something of a nightmare, hence your movement away from them. I myself already have another prototype script to replace this functionality, however, the fact that what was once a 1-liner js now becomes a separate file, thus increasing page-load that little bit more nearly(by no means fully) makes the reason I utilized these over jquery tabs redundant. (rantoff) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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