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j.hamley

Undecided: IPB or vB

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Stallyon, Internet Brands does not listen to their customers, I am a current customer, and I am really regretting owning over 5 vBulletin Licenses. I will be converting them to IPB shortly.

vBulletin has an excellent background, but, the new owners only seem to see $$ in the customer and base. Their irreparable decisions are forwarding the product down the spiral.

That said, I am missing the massive modifications base, and I've yet to see IPB excel in their area.

IPB have presented me with information I can use, a sort of roadmap, that allows me to make inform decisions on time-management, and other crucial things. IPS is a crucial paradigm in delivering and communicating with customers, one thing sorely lacking at IB's vB.

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With the questions that you have posed, the greatest difference for me is the blogs. My users were confused terribly with Vb Blogs, its cumbersome and counter intuitive in so many ways. IPB take on blogs is clean, logical, attractive and speedy.

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Most people ehre are jujst going to say IPB automatically and pretend vb is garbage. In reality any successful software is good. I personally like IPB more. But I don't pretend that vb has nothing good about it. All I know is IPB has most of what I want other than it's not capable out of the box of limiting registrations and forum access based on various things (mostly I need upper and lower age limits) and I don't like the skin exactly. I may just change the color using the skin generator, but it's a bit limited in what is changed in that easy fashion.



I'm not an IPB forum "owner" at the moment. I own several licenses but haven't officially launched a site, in the process of launching one and converting another, possibly two. Do not mistake vB 3 with vB 4. The former was one of the best pieces of software for its time, even now it's very good, although it is aging and totally unsupported. vB 4 is a half-baked attempt to half-rewrite and add on to vB and it is a complete and total disaster.

The reason I'm here is because I've discovered what a disaster vB 4 is. If you don't believe me, ask someone to give you access to the vB 4 forums. Without even getting into the way they have treated the customer, let's talk specifics on product. VB 4's CSS and markup is a catastrophe. They created a "stylevar" system which tries to create variables for every aspect of a CSS element and it was evidently done by different programmers, inconsistent and impossible to work with. The markup went from table based to tableless for the sake of doing so. Do you wonder why at this late date there might be 10 vB 4 styles to buy, most of which aren't that good? There is a reason for it and they are now finally talking about rewriting this area but not telling the users what is going on. This is a good starter.



People, let's remember that we are not here to bash the competition. We are better than that. I will agree vBulletin was a great piece of software (and still is good). IB (vB) are novices at the software game and it will take some time to develop both the knowledge and the experience to run the company and produce relatively bug-free gold versions. So let's just tell potential customers the PROS of going IP.Board and let them make their own educated decision of what's best for them.



I will freely say exactly what my experience is and it is not "bashing" at all. vB 3 is an excellent piece of software. It is everything and more you need to run a great forum. Truth is I don't need anything more now but I didn't want a mobile skin, more social media ability to publicize what we do and also to ensure that the software would be compatible with future versions of php/mysql. The problem is the natural progression, vb4, is currently going nowhere fast. It has nothing at all to do with bug free gold versions. vB was written to take advantage of a desire for a company to show profits in a quarter and the haste they had in trying to shove the code in there as quickly as possible is now causing the foreseeable huge problems in the core code that exists.

I have no stake in this matter. It pains me because I'm losing time and money having to deal with the VB situation. You are free to decide whatever you want to do. My opinion is, unfortunately, probably consistent with most you'll read because it is what it is.

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There are pros and cons to either system based on what you want to achieve.

- There are more mods in vB but more features in IPS (and more official products which means less mods needed)
- I think it is a lot harder to find coders and custom designers for IPS but then again, few designers will touch vB4 with a barge pole.
- vB seems to have faster response on their forums and more activity (which is a lot of negativity the past year), but here the devs seem to actually listen, discuss and often implement ideas and suggestions direct from the customer base. You only need to compare the IPS company blogs to the vB company blogs to see who is more communicative. This gives the feeling that the growth of IPS products are at least partly evolved from customer requirements as opposed to design process at vB which feels esoteric, defensive and "handed down from on high".

Having worked on the vB modding community for years I believe that IPS has a far superior code base and more importantly a team that really want to make IPS the best that it can be (vB no longer has many of those types of developers). That desire alone gives IPS the upper hand in long term sustainability and a long term death sentence to vB. But that isn't now and it isn't today. So you're best bet is to really sit down and identify the things that you are looking for in your site and research both camps to see which ticks the majority of the boxes.

Thats what I did and guess which package I chose for me and my community? :)

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I am also a Vbulletin forum owner (running 3.8.x, with a 4.x in testing), and am at the point where I am considering a jump. The lack of communication, even by Adrian, indicates to me there is no clear direction being given internally, let alone to the customers, so I'm evaluating my options.

Fortunately, I don't have a large forum, but I want to grow it, and was planning a brand new launch with VB 4. I don't see that happening any time soon, and I want to give my existing users functionality that I promised last year, but haven't been able to deliver.

My prime concern is having to eat a loss on my VB license to pay for a IPB one.

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I am also a Vbulletin forum owner (running 3.8.x, with a 4.x in testing), and am at the point where I am considering a jump. The lack of communication, even by Adrian, indicates to me there is no clear direction being given internally, let alone to the customers, so I'm evaluating my options.



Fortunately, I don't have a large forum, but I want to grow it, and was planning a brand new launch with VB 4. I don't see that happening any time soon, and I want to give my existing users functionality that I promised last year, but haven't been able to deliver.



My prime concern is having to eat a loss on my VB license to pay for a IPB one.




Well yeah you have to eat the difference you can sell your vb license - also when vb5 comes out and they ask people to pay $200 to upgrade compared to $25 every 6 months that you only renew if and when you wish to!

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I converted my forum from vB to IPB a few months ago. I dropped vB and went with IPB because I trust IPB with the future of my forum. I have lost all faith and trust in the new owners of vB and would not entrust the future of my forum to Internet Brands.

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Hello everybody!



I am the owner of a couple of huge forums running on free software. Due to some good funds I received recently, I would like to move both forums to commercial software and develop a website to go along with the community. As many, I am undecided between IPB and vB. Both forums are about collectibles. In addition to the forum, I would like to have a frontend developed for both websites. The main purpose of the frontend will be to show articles from my users and to handle a database of collectibles - something like movie or book archives, where you can enter movies, assign them to categories, and so on. I imagine something like cheapassgamer.com, but applied to very different markets. I have these questions that could help me decide - I know you will necessarily be biased towards IPB, and I accept that, and that is why I am posting in both vB and IPB forums! I have great respect for both platforms, and this is why I am undecided!



1. I will be hiring developers to do so, but can IP.Content be used to develop a frontend as the one I need? How difficult would it be?


2. How user friendly is the IPB Blog feature compared to the vBulletin one? Anybody has used them for a decent amount of time to tell me the main differences?


3. In brief, is there some unique feature to IPB I should be aware of?



Jane




1.) I've heard nothing but positive stuff from IP.Content. You can take something you have and you can make it into whatever page you want. It's definitely a much lighter and more powerful system than vBulletin's CMS.
2.) I'm not a blogger, so it's best to ask someone who is.
3.) IPB 3.0 was the first forum software to offer Facebook Connect and OpenID as alternative and convenient ways to login. By the time vBulletin had Facebook Connect (which has been usually broken in most other vB4 forums I've been at), IPB 3.1 improved its own version of Facebook Connect but it now adds the Twitter equivalent as well.

Why not talk about SEO? vBSEO has been a proven option (other than that it adds bloat), but IPB 3.1 is SEO-friendly out of the box. No SEO systems needed.

What about the ACP? vBulletin is the ONLY forum software that still uses iFrames. Every forum software has advanced its Admin CP to at least asthetically make things easier and more user-friendly, but then IPB (after MyBB) adds the Live Search, making features easy to look up and everything. Why not talk about ads? Everyone needs them. What I don't get is why vBulletin wants a share of ad money and the access to ad information. To me, it's really a no-brainer if you're gonna pick IPB and vBulletin. Pricing, quality, support, we have it all. The staff member fix your problems for you in a matter of hours, no premium pricing needed.

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Switching forum software is a big commitment in terms of cost and effort. You're wise to do your research and consider it fully. Most of your members probably couldn't care-less what software you're running.

However, you have to have faith and trust in any software you upload to your web server. You have to have faith that it will work as advertised and be satisfactory to your community and you have to trust the company behind it to ensure it has the very best security and that they're responsible when it comes to future updates. You enter a relationship with a software vendor and like any good relationship, you can have some ups and downs as long as you believe that it's worth the time and effort.

No software is perfect, we certainly don't claim that. What we do stand by is our core principals to be honest, open and give a fair deal. This is our livelihood and how we pay our bills. We put our heart and soul into our software not because we want to be proud of it, but because we want *you* to be proud of it.

We all love what we do, and I think that shines through our work and puts a little magic into our software.

So really, the only question you have to answer is "Do you see a future with us, or with your current vendor?".

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Nice subtle jabs, Matt :thumbsup:

Not that I disagree with what you are saying, but I've always been one to support the "this is why we're good" not the "this is why they suck" approach. You may argue you are proving the former, but those deeply in-tune with what is going on will know you went with the latter.

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Those are very good points to bring up Matt, and the fact that the Chief Software Architect pointed it out shows me that you guys are much more communicative then VB at this point. Which is a shame, since a few years ago VB devs were actively involved with the community, rather than seemingly hide out in a bunker.

Now to dig up some cash. :)

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Ive just converted a vb4 forum over to IPB - vbulletin is a company and software in decline and Internet Brands seem to excel at making things get worse and worse!





Any chance IB has little motivation to improve VB too much because they are competing with their own customers ? :rolleyes:

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With the questions that you have posed, the greatest difference for me is the blogs. My users were confused terribly with Vb Blogs, its cumbersome and counter intuitive in so many ways. IPB take on blogs is clean, logical, attractive and speedy.





Blogs are good ... a TUBE feature with video tagging system would be far better for traffic generation.

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Any chance IB has little motivation to improve VB too much because they are competing with their own customers ? :rolleyes:



Unfortunately that's not a funny comment. It has been tossed around numerous times that IB has not upgraded virtually any of their forums to vB 4, which has been out 10 months. They also give out no information for a roadmap of what to expect, costing their own licenseholders significant time and money doing all the work again every time they upgrade. The sentiment around the watering hole seems to be that they don't really care and costing the competition time and money... and I guess it only helps lower a potential acquisition price.

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Hello everybody!



I am the owner of a couple of huge forums running on free software. Due to some good funds I received recently, I would like to move both forums to commercial software and develop a website to go along with the community. As many, I am undecided between IPB and vB. Both forums are about collectibles. In addition to the forum, I would like to have a frontend developed for both websites. The main purpose of the frontend will be to show articles from my users and to handle a database of collectibles - something like movie or book archives, where you can enter movies, assign them to categories, and so on. I imagine something like cheapassgamer.com, but applied to very different markets. I have these questions that could help me decide - I know you will necessarily be biased towards IPB, and I accept that, and that is why I am posting in both vB and IPB forums! I have great respect for both platforms, and this is why I am undecided!



1. I will be hiring developers to do so, but can IP.Content be used to develop a frontend as the one I need? How difficult would it be?


2. How user friendly is the IPB Blog feature compared to the vBulletin one? Anybody has used them for a decent amount of time to tell me the main differences?


3. In brief, is there some unique feature to IPB I should be aware of?



Jane




In terms of your original question let me put it like this. I had 2 boards that ran through to VB 3.6. Towards the end of last year I converted one. By April I had converted the 2nd one. I've not been around the vb boards since the end of last year, however I wanted to start a new project and the cheapest way to get it off the ground was to use my 3.6 vb forum. In turn I upgraded to 4.0.5 to see how it went, seeing as it was discounted to $30. What a joke. There is so much stuff that is built into IPB that is an additional extra in vb that it will cost me lots more if I progress down this road. It's false economy. I will simply start up the process and move across when I can afford it and once the membership has expanded.

Publishing v IP.Content - definitely the latter. Much more versatile, very easy to work with and highly integrated.
Blogs - again I find IPB version much more integrated and I can't actually believe how bad the vb one is in comparison (I used it previously and its not much better in the new version).

IPB has a gallery by default, IPB has a link directory by default, you see where I am coming from. There are still long lists of useful bolt-ons that don't work in the new version and the number of sites sticking with 3.8 instead of upgrading to version 4 reflects this.

In my experience at least its a no-brainer. Look at the number of people coming to IPB from VB and the support they have got. Now do the same in reverse and look at the reception they have got. It speaks for itself.

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Thanks!



I'm doing the conversion as we speak. First questions my members had was "Do we still get to keep the arcade?" :)




iArcade 1.1 Alpha 2 is now in testing. :P
http://iarcademod.com/community/index.php?/topic/222-iarcade-11-alpha-2-demo-live/
http://iarcademod.com/community/index.php?app=iArcade

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Unfortunately that's not a funny comment. It has been tossed around numerous times that IB has not upgraded virtually any of their forums to vB 4, which has been out 10 months. They also give out no information for a roadmap of what to expect, costing their own licenseholders significant time and money doing all the work again every time they upgrade. The sentiment around the watering hole seems to be that they don't really care and costing the competition time and money... and I guess it only helps lower a potential acquisition price.





Time will tell ...

I'm sure it was a challenge not to run with the original VB programming team.

(maybe Charles can hire some of them, he may need more staff after Nexus comes out) :)

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