Live Update

[Marcello]

How would the auto updater be able to tell the difference between boards that have a legit license key, and boards that were downloaded and installed illegally?

That wouldn't really be your problem, would it? :)

I do like the idea though, although I wouldn't be able to use it, since (as already said) I'll be one of those who have at least 1 mod installed. But it's good to get a discussion like this started, it might give IPS new insight. :thumbsup:

[Davidcopperfield]

I do like the idea though, although I wouldn't be able to use it, since (as already said) I'll be one of those who have at least 1 mod installed.

Not really as I stated above that this kind of feature would create a buffer file, where all the database changes/odds would reside till the Update is completed. If the mod version turns out to be not compatible with the newer version of the software (ipb, ipd, blog gallery, Vectura, naxus), the contents of the mod would be kept on your HD or Server to be applied when you finally install the new version of mod compatible with contemporary software version. As you all see this ferature is designed for all IPS proucts. :)

The only problem is

Most hosts have PHP compiled into the webserver, meaning it runs under a common, low-privilege user (commonly 'nobody'). In order to modify the source files to patch and auto-update them, they would need to be writeable by the webserver user. This means the can be written by any script that is run through the webserver, which is *really* bad on shared hosting where another customer could overwrite the files of another user. Or, if a security hole existed in IPB or another script on the server, the IPB install could be erased by a third-party hacker.

Then, when visiting the ACP or looging in the board you would get a notification of the newer version then you would just switch your for instance macro in FTP client that would open necessary ports/CHMODS. Sorry I do not know this matter precisely.

ps ( I ought to be employed by IPS then all products would get a boost :P )

[.SiLlY.]

Let's take this last update for example... I surely would like to control when my board got messed up. Just like you mentioned.."Windows and etc...". Even those updates/patches corrupt your pc at times. To much at risk. And i think an active site being upgraded before being beta tested by yourself is asking for trouble. Of course if the world was perfect.. this would be an awesome mod. But we all know it isnt. And neither is 2.1.1. lol ;)

[Davidcopperfield]

Yes, such mod would require much beta testing. advantages are obvious for instance you leave your home and have no acces to the internet or insufficient internet connection/time security to perform the update, in such situation this sort of mode would help out much provided that has been tested thoroughly. :) I would like to see some opinions from IPS Managemernt or Staff member.

[hartzr]

Then if something goes wrong, you have 15,000 customers with their boards blown up. If you want easier upgrades, I think more seperation of code from layout with a plugin structure free from hacks would be the answer.

[Davidcopperfield]

Then if something goes wrong, you have 15,000 customers with their boards blown up.

Then before allowing actual diaplay of newer version you would have to confirm it by some way clicking Yes or no In ACP if you jugde that everything is in order then you approve if not you disaaprove and you are taken back to the last stable version (and asked) to update manualyy as simple as that. :)

[Morello]

I think this would be a good idea if done correctly. But how would you go about creating this so-called "buffer file"? Without some sort of mod manager (which I suggested like 5 minutes ago), IPB would have no way of knowing what mods had been installed without doing some thing like this:

download current version and check board files for consistency; note changes in a buffer file (if that's what you wanna call it); download new version; rewrite all the files; tell admin what files had been changed and what about those files were changed

and even then, that just gives you a bunch of random script pieces that is so hard to figure out you'd be better off just reinstalling the mod from scratch

there's a reason the windows xp files are protected. it's so you can't mod it. if you modded it, there'd be problems when it came time to update.

but, if there were an update feature on IPB, how about an updater that just goes in and only changes the parts of the scripts that need change? it still wouldn't work well with mods, but it'd be easier than installing a new version from scratch.

basically: this wouldn't work :x

[Davidcopperfield]

but, if there were an update feature on IPB, how about an updater that just goes in and only changes the parts of the scripts that need change? it still wouldn't work well with mods, but it'd be easier than installing a new version from scratch.

basically: this wouldn't work :x

As you see now IPS went for their own mods production on IPD Product Development, thus their mods migh be suited to such feature. :cool:

[bfarber]

This just simply wouldn't work reliably, and we'd end up with more unhappy campers than happy customers. ;)

Firstly, we don't have the time or energy to be testing and supporting third party modifications. To do something like this, we'd have to. To do something like a buffer file, we'd have to (for example) FIRST grep/compare all the changes in your existing files against the version you are running and find the differences. This alone could be unreliable, if for example a mod only changes one line, or part of a query, or something like that. Say it did pull the changes though.

Then permissions is the next issue. As stated earlier, your PHP engine likely is not going to have the permissions that you have when uploading files through FTP. Say you upload files through FTP as user Apache. PHP runs as nobody. This is a relatively common setup, and overwriting the files is not going to work unless you keep all files chmod 777, which is an unnecessary security risk. You may very well never have problems, but it wouldn't be necessary to introduce a hole like this without good cause, and I wouldn't see this as a good enough cause.

Ok, so say you then opened this hole so you could get updates like a week earlier than if you updated manually...

The legality is an issue. It doesn't matter if someone could get their update from an illegal hacker. We'd be PROVIDING it for them, so users could get an illegal copy of the board and get unlimited free updates?? This doesn't sound like a smart business move on our part. ;)

Not to mention the potential issues that could arise if someone didn't realize this feature existed and thus never shut it off (but had a HUGE site with many visitors and many mods). I'd suspect they'd be quite unhappy.

Then the files get overwritten and caches rebuilt, database queries run, etc. What happens if it fails half way through for some reason (say you have a mod installed that edited a database column and the upgrader couldn't know this would happen). You may never know your upgrade failed half way through. Or at best, you wouldn't know WHERE the upgrade failed at.

Then, say it finished. It's going to try to re-implement your code changes from a modification? We're not going to support third party modifications in this manner, so this part is almost out of the question.

Really, for the 5-10 minutes it takes to upload files and run the upgrade script I don't see the benefit of introducing a system prone to failure at some level.

And even then, we provide free upgrade services for customers with existing licenses. So if you don't want to go through the hassle of upgrading (if you would call it that), submit a ticket and we'll do it. :)

[SpireInc]

In order to do this you'd have to modify the permissions on each file ont he FTP which has it's security issues.